MINUTES: 18 August 2020 ARIA Authoring Practices Task Force

Link:
https://www.w3.org/2020/08/18-aria-apg-minutes.html



W3C
- DRAFT -
ARIA Authoring Practices Task Force
18 Aug 2020
Attendees

Present
    mck, jongund, MarkMccarthy, sarah_higley, CurtBellew, Jemma
Regrets
Chair
    Matt King
Scribe
    sarah_higley

Contents

    Topics
        Coding Styling Guide
        Site navigation systems (menus) plan
        Navigation Menus
        Open Pull Requests
    Summary of Action Items
    Summary of Resolutions

<jongund> scribe jongund

<jongund> scribe, jongund
Coding Styling Guide

<jongund> MK: Sara this is your topic

<jongund> SH: I am not quite finished, too many meetings

<jongund> SH: I have a branch open on the wiki, includes waht Matt wrote

<jongund> SH: I don't think worth our time to develop our own style guide, just use AirBNB style guide

<jongund> MK: Does it conver HTML, CSS and JS

<jongund> SH: It covers JS, I am not sure about CSS or HTML

<jongund> SH: We should just use it

<jongund> MK: I am all for off loading it

<jongund> MK: Unless there are exceptions or specific chnages

<jongund> SH: We should focus more on ....

<jongund> SH: discussion of audio quality...

<jongund> looking for new mic....

<jongund> MS: I prefer AirBNB style guide too

<jongund> SH: AirBNB is very specific, we should focus on higher level stuff, naming and organization of code

<jongund> MK: The readability across examples is important

<jongund> MK: I am assuming a high portion of the AirBNB stuff is stuff we are already linting for

<jongund> SH: I am surprised at the stuff our linter is not fixing, so I need to look at this more

<jongund> MK: The end goal is a wiki page for creating examples

<jongund> MK: We want this to be used by code reviewers, new people

<jongund> MK: When will it be ready?

<jongund> SH: Let's aim for having a draft dine by the need of the month and then comments next month

<jongund> SH: Working to add more examples

<jongund> MK: You say you are working on this in a branch, do you know how to merge?

<jongund> SH: I don't know

<jongund> MK: How do you merge a wiki page

<jongund> SH: I can make a gist if we can't merge

<jongund> MK: We should test it

<jongund> SH: I can make a personal wiki and give people permission to edit

<jongund> MK: People can clone and make changes

<jongund> SH: Idea wise a combination of naming for different types of functions

<jongund> SH: There is more conceptual stuff, that are more pure functions that do not have external dependencies

<jongund> JG: What about using prototypes accessing the objects

<jongund> SH: Writing pure functions is easier to understand

<jongund> SH: If you are filtering combobox items, you pass in and return an array

<jongund> JG: In my combobox examples you would pass in the same array that is passed in is the same as what you return

<jongund> SH: There are probably two arrays one with all the items and one with the filtered results

<jongund> MK: It would be great to have consistency of this stuff for the engineering community to consume this stuff

<jongund> MK: I look to JG who teaches students to be pedagogical in nature to balance off the needs of production engineers

<jongund> MK: I trying to remember what one part of code, when you are working on another piece of code

<jongund> MK: The less you have to remember

<Jemma> will code guide include some examples ?

<jongund> MK: My hope when we have the wiki available and make our code more useful for engineers who work on code to learn about accessibility

<jongund> MK: I would like to get more Facebook engineers reviewing code

<jongund> MK: We need to be careful about managing our pull requests
Site navigation systems (menus) plan
Navigation Menus

<Jemma> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/89

<jongund> MK: The issues related to this have alot of comments

<jongund> MK: Issue 89

<jongund> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/89

<carmacleod> PR: https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pull/1492

<jongund> MK: I am trying to imagine a light weight section on the different types of widgets that could be used and maybe some type of guidance on capabilities and complexity

<jongund> MK: Information that would help people choose

<jongund> MK: I would like to get conceptual feedback, and then I will take the feedback and revise the PR

<jongund> MK: Because this is an aggregation of information already in the document, maybe we can do something by next month

<jongund> MK: The example by sara changes the content on page, they just change the content on the page

<jongund> SH: I think they should be similiar

<jongund> SH: What about a more conventional menu bar?

<jongund> SH: I am constantly working of the developer who are trying to use this pattern

<jongund> SH: If we tweek the example to mot look like a navigation menu

<jongund> MK: It you are making site navigation using the menubar, this is the way you would do it

<jongund> MK: We would make sure that all the navigation menu bar optins

<jongund> JSH: I don;t think we should be promoting menubar for site navigation

<jongund> MK: There are alot of issues here, there maybe some cases where it might be useful

<jongund> JG: We need to do more to help people understand the issues of navigatino menus, we are not doing a very good job right now

<jongund> JG: I am already teaching this issues of navigation

<jongund> MK: I think we need something that is light weight, if they all provide similar navigation

<jongund> MK: We can explain the features in example

<jongund> JG: We will only be dong small changes in PRs to get more consistency

<jongund> MK: I will look at a plan for making changes to the PRs

<jongund> SH: Should I wait to raise issues until there is a PR?

<jongund> SH: What I mean we need to look at the examples and how it effects the development community, people use the term menu and then only see menubar

<jongund> SH: We do not want people to use the menubar bar for most site navigation

<jongund> SH: Especially people from smaller organizations who do not have the time to look at all the options

<jongund> MK: I don't want to create a gap in the ....

<jongund> MK: I think the problem is partial implementation

<jongund> SH: I think it is a problem even with

<jongund> CM: Users don;t like it in usability testings

<jongund> JG: Do we have time to talk about open PRs?

<jongund> MK: If a screen reader doesn't work with manubars

<jongund> CM: People expect to type tabs, not arrow keys through links, bottom line

<jongund> MK: I think this is an important topic
Open Pull Requests

<carmacleod> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/pulls?q=is%3Apr+is%3Aopen+

<scribe> scribe: sarah_higley

JG: Valerie's PR is about fixing tests that are failing in Travis
... so if we just mark those tests as failing in her PR or mine, then I can merge, since my PR has been sitting for a long time

MK: so this is blocking the menubutton PR, #1401
... so for these tests to pass, we should just need to rebase after merging Valerie's change
... yup, PR 1488 was merged and should fix failing checks in other PRs
... I can get Valerie to take a look at this on Thursday
... we need people to finish the other items on the review checklist, we should prioritized that
... I think the PR that's closest is the radio button update, 1401. I'll add the review checklist
... who's available for reviews in the next several days, particularly for accessibility and design?

JG: the changes there are just to the code, and some CSS

MK: I want to look at the radio button one, to make sure we're good to merge. There was some discussion about the style, could open a separate issue for that

JG: style changes happened three years ago

MK: we won't change this PR for that
... Mark made a comment on high contrast -- was that addressed?

MM: on the topic of vertical vs. horizontal, it was a bit confusing for a keyboard user to understand how to use them. They would expect up/down and left/right to change based on orientation, and they do not

MK: maybe you could raise an issue for that, could you do that?
... to make up and left work the same, and down and right
... and then we'll all prioritize #1401, and the carousel PR
... we're at time, so I'll send out specific requests to people

JG: also carousel, menubutton because they've been out there so long. I can work on radio button.
... Zoe made some changes to the radio button styles, would anyone mind if I changed those to SVGs?

MK: maybe keep it the same for now to get it in, and do a separate PR
Summary of Action Items
Summary of Resolutions
[End of minutes]
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Jon Gunderson, Ph.D., CPWA
Coordinator of Accessible IT Group
University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign
1207 S. Oak Street
Champaign, IL 61820

Phone: (217) 244-5870
E-mail: jongund@illinois.edu<mailto:jongund@illinois.edu?Subject=Re%3A%20Alternative%20date%20combobox%20grid%20date%20picker%20example%20for%20ARIA%20APG&In-Reply-To=%3CBYAPR11MB3413C2168E1DF82F6E4C7B2CC8BE0%40BYAPR11MB3413.namprd11.prod.outlook.com%3E&References=%3CBYAPR11MB3413C2168E1DF82F6E4C7B2CC8BE0%40BYAPR11MB3413.namprd11.prod.outlook.com%3E><mailto:jongund@illinois.edu<mailto:jongund@illinois.edu?Subject=Re%3A%20Alternative%20date%20combobox%20grid%20date%20picker%20example%20for%20ARIA%20APG&In-Reply-To=%3CBYAPR11MB3413C2168E1DF82F6E4C7B2CC8BE0%40BYAPR11MB3413.namprd11.prod.outlook.com%3E&References=%3CBYAPR11MB3413C2168E1DF82F6E4C7B2CC8BE0%40BYAPR11MB3413.namprd11.prod.outlook.com%3E>>
www: https://go.illinois.edu/jongund