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Web Services Description Working Group 2002-03-07 meeting minutes

From: Jonathan Marsh <jmarsh@microsoft.com>
Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2002 17:54:11 -0800
Message-ID: <330564469BFEC046B84E591EB3D4D59C0554C224@red-msg-08.redmond.corp.microsoft.com>
To: <www-ws-desc@w3.org>
(Chair apologizes for neglecting to forward these minutes to the public list.)

Web Services Description Working Group 2002-03-07 meeting minutes

Full minutes: http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/2/03-07-minutes (members only)

Attendance
- Keith Ballinger, Microsoft Corporation 
- David Booth, W3C 
- Roberto Chinnici, Sun Microsystems 
- Glen Daniels, Macromedia 
- Mike Davoren, W. W. Grainger 
- Martin Gudgin, Developmentor 
- Jacek Kopecky, Systinet 
- Alan Kotok, DISA 
- Sandeep Kumar, Cisco 
- Pallavi Malu, Intel Corporation 
- Jonathan Marsh, Microsoft Corporation 
- Mike McHugh, W. W. Grainger 
- Jeff Mischkinsky, Oracle Corporation 
- Dale Moberg, Cyclone Commerce 
- Arthur Ryman, IBM 
- Jeffrey Schlimmer, Microsoft Corporation 
- Aaron Skonnard, Developmentor 
- William Stumbo, Xerox 
- Sandra Swearingen, U.S. Department of Defense, U.S. Air Force 
- Jerry Thrasher, Lexmark 
- William Vambenepe, Hewlett-Packard Company 
- Sanjiva Weerawarana, IBM Corporation 
- Don Wright, Lexmark 
- Prasad Yendluri, webMethods, Inc. 
- Dietmar Gaertner, Software AG 

Regrets:
- Michael Champion, Software AG 
- Youenn Fablet, Canon alternate 
- Mario Jeckle, DaimlerChrysler Research and Technology 
- Tom Jordahl, Macromedia 
- Kevin Canyang Liu, SAP 
- Jean-Jacques Moreau, Canon 
- Johan Pauhlsson, L'Echangeur 
- Jochen Ruetschlin, DaimlerChrysler Research and Technology 
- Waqar Sadiq, Electronic Data Systems 
- Adi Sakala, IONA Technologies 

Absents:
- Mike Ballantyne, Electronic Data Systems 
- Laurent De Teneuille, L'Echangeur 
- Tim Finin, University of Maryland 
- Dan Kulp, IONA Technologies 
- Philippe Le H├ęgaret, W3C 
- Michael Mealling, Verisign 
- Dave Solo, Citigroup 
- Daniel Schutzer, Citigroup 
- Igor Sedukhin, Computer Associates 
- Rich Salz, Zolera Systems 
- Krishna Sankar, Cisco Systems 

Observers:
- Ayse Dilber, AT&T 
- Stefano Pugliani, Sun 

Review of outstanding action items
- Unknown 2002.03.05. Jean-Jacques Moreau agreed to aggregate the requirements related to SOAP 1.2. 
- DONE 2002.03.05. David Booth agreed to simplify section 3.2 on simplicity. 
- DONE 2002.03.XX. Jeffrey Schlimmer to combine DR033 and 034, and propose new language by e-mail. 
- In Progress 2002.02.14. Jonathan Marsh will map the Face-to-Face meetings 6 months in advance. Due date: Unspecified. 

Agenda Items

Approval of minutes
Participants approved the Feb 28 minutes with no further corrections.

Scribe
Kieth Ballinger, Microsoft.

Face to face details

(See full minutes for FTF details.)

CVS details for editors

All editors except Waqir want direct CVS access.

ACTION: Philippe to ensure everyone has accounts.

Requirements

Simplicity section walkthrough with David Booth (see http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-desc/2002Mar/att-0005/01-simplicity.htm).

Keith : How we are quantifying simplicity?

Gudge : Compared to other XML Languages, such as schema?

David Booth : This is a motherhood and apple pie requirement, not productive to go further into it

Sanjiva : Simple as possible.

Arthur : Lack of concrete example in the old WSDL spec would have made it simpler.

Sanviva : Question on DR14 on ease of deployment.

David Booth : deployment was moved up into DR13.

Jonathan : Any objections to accepting changes David Booth made?

DECISION: No objections.

DR109 and others

Jeffrey : 33, 34 discussed last time dealing with interfaces. Confusion about difference between this and inheritance. Wording in 109 is a first cut at this.

Jonathan : Jean-Jacques proposed breaking this up into a different set of requirements.

Keith : Not simple requirement from Jean-Jacques.

Jeffrey : Propose that we make "D" from Jean-Jacques a MUST requirement.

Keith : Agree.

David Booth : Suggest we would not make the others from Jean-Jacques requirements.

Jeffrey : propose we make the first thing not a requirement

Everyone aggrees.

Keith : no use in making this a requirement

Glen : Are we getting too close to implementation?

Keith : we shouldn't be afraid to import or not.

Lots of discussion on this

 

Jeffrey : Let's get some new wording for the requirement

Sanjiva - [the new requirement text]

Minor quibbles

David Booth : volunteer to come up with new wording for this requirement

 

Keith : Jean-Jacques's <any> requirement shouldn't be a requirement, and we should have extensibility requirements

Jeffrey : Anything else in item C

Jonathan : Back to 109.

Jeffrey : [read it]

Glen : What's an interface? Set of messages? An API? Something else?

Jeffrey : You would like to be comfortable with a definition of the word interface first?

Sandeep : We also need to capture the capabilities of a service

Minor discussion with Keith

Glen : would like to see a clear definition of the problem we are trying to solve.

Keith : are you proposing that WSDL defines XML like things? IDL like things?

Jeffrey : We have several requirements that we allow us to send XML interfaces.

Keith : should we use portType instead of interface?

Minor disagreements

Keith : we should define "operation", "interface", and "binding"

David Booth : volunteers to define the terms

Keith : volunteers to help

ACTION: Keith and David to define these.

 

David Booth : new wording for import requirement

 

Some discussion

Jonathan : People like it? 

Approved

 

Jonathan : Requirement 42 text

Jeffrey : described problem UPnP groups interface inheritance problem 

Glen - Really this is reuse.

Some discussion

Jeffrey : Keith and Jeffrey will go back and think some more about this one

Jonathan : you may want to look at David Booth's 071s text

David Booth : This new one could replace 71

Jeffrey : let's throw away the new one, and keep 71

Wide agreement 

ACTION: Jeffrey and Keith will go propose new text for 42.

Different discussion on open content models

 

Jonathan - Section 3.9 and 3.10 will be next weeks focus

Arthur : requests that next week we solve the relationship with WS-I.

 

ACTION: Keith will take an item to discuss open content model design.

 

Use Cases
We will spend some time discussing use cases next week.

Action Items

- CONTINUED 2002.03.05. Jean-Jacques Moreau agreed to aggregate the requirements related to SOAP 1.2. 
- CONTINUED. 2002.02.14. Jonathan Marsh will map the Face-to-Face meetings 6 months in advance. Due date: Unspecified. 
- 2002.03.07 ACTION: Philippe to ensure everyone has accounts. 
- 2002.03.07 ACTION: Jeffrey and Keith will go propose new text for 42. 
- 2002.03.07 ACTION: Keith will take an item to discuss open content model design. 
- 2002.03.07 ACTION: Keith and David to define these. 

Scribe: Keith Ballinger, Microsoft
Received on Thursday, 21 March 2002 20:54:49 GMT

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