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Re: W3C/WS-I Coordination

From: Steve Bratt <steve@w3.org>
Date: Mon, 07 Jun 2004 20:39:56 -0400
Message-ID: <40C50ADC.2060904@w3.org>
To: Ed Cobb <ecobb@bea.com>
Cc: www-ws-cg@w3.org, wsi_liaison@lists.ws-i.org, Hugo Haas <hugo@w3.org>

Hi Ed,

The OMA data was sent in April between our appointed PoC, Hugo Haas and 
Jeff Mischkinsky.  See below.  As you said, the OMA OMU is now Member 
visible ...
     http://www.w3.org/2004/05/W3C-OMA-Agreement-FINAL.html


Looking forward to WS-I's response.

Regards,

Steve

=======================



Subject:
MoU between WS-I and W3C
From:
Hugo Haas <hugo@w3.org>
Date:
Fri, 9 Apr 2004 15:29:22 +0200
To:
Jeff Mischkinsky <jeff.mischkinsky@oracle.com>
BCC:
hugo+archive@homer.w3.org

Hi Jeff.

As part of the discussions between W3C and WS-I, Steve sent an email
to Ed Cobb suggesting that we could look into draft an memorandum of
understanding (MoU) between the two organizations to facilitate their
cooperation[1].

I have been thinking about what the content of this MoU could be with
regards to the way we work and the products of the two organizations,
as well as their specificities, taking the OMA MoU as a template.

As you and I are the respective point of contacts, I wanted to run
this by you before we go any further.

The three following aspects are of interest:
- W3C and WS-I can participate, when both sides agree, in each others'
   meetings.
- when a contribution is made from one of the parties, this
   contribution remains under its IPR terms; obviously, the
   organization accepting the contribution may need to perform some
   extra IPR checks if it decides to integrate this contribution into a
   document.
- when a party makes a document available to the other party, it is
   available to all the members of this other party.

Does this list look good to you? Are there other mechanisms that you
think would be useful?

Regards,

Hugo

   1. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-ws-cg/2004Feb/0001.html
-- Hugo Haas - W3C mailto:hugo@w3.org - http://www.w3.org/People/Hugo/



Subject:
Re: MoU between WS-I and W3C
From:
Hugo Haas <hugo@w3.org>
Date:
Fri, 30 Apr 2004 11:47:22 +0200
To:
Jeff Mischkinsky <jeff.mischkinsky@oracle.com>
BCC:
hugo+archive@homer.w3.org

Hi Jeff.

* Hugo Haas <hugo@w3.org> [2004-04-09 15:29+0200]

 >> As part of the discussions between W3C and WS-I, Steve sent an email
 >> to Ed Cobb suggesting that we could look into draft an memorandum of
 >> understanding (MoU) between the two organizations to facilitate their
 >> cooperation[1].
 >>
 >> I have been thinking about what the content of this MoU could be with
 >> regards to the way we work and the products of the two organizations,
 >> as well as their specificities, taking the OMA MoU as a template.
 >>
 >> As you and I are the respective point of contacts, I wanted to run
 >> this by you before we go any further.
 >>
 >> The three following aspects are of interest:
 >> - W3C and WS-I can participate, when both sides agree, in each others'
 >>   meetings.
 >> - when a contribution is made from one of the parties, this
 >>   contribution remains under its IPR terms; obviously, the
 >>   organization accepting the contribution may need to perform some
 >>   extra IPR checks if it decides to integrate this contribution into a
 >>   document.
 >> - when a party makes a document available to the other party, it is
 >>   available to all the members of this other party.
 >>
 >> Does this list look good to you? Are there other mechanisms that you
 >> think would be useful?


Did you have a chance to look into that? If you don't see any issues,
I'll tell Steve to use it as the basis for his discussions.

Regards,

Hugo

-- Hugo Haas - W3C mailto:hugo@w3.org - http://www.w3.org/People/Hugo/

Ed Cobb wrote:
> 	Hi, Steve.
> 	I do have your mail from February, but nothing from April. Art Barstow from Nokia sent me an early draft of the OMA collaboration document and, I know the final one is on the W3C web-site (which I've asked my W3C rep to get, since I don't have access personally), but if you sent me something in April, I haven't seen it.
> 
> *********************************************************************
> Edward Cobb, Vice President, Architecture & Standards
> BEA Systems, Inc., 2315 North First St., San Jose, CA 95131
> Tel: 408-570-8264 / Fax: 408-570-8914 / Mobile 408-464-0733
> E-mail: ed.cobb@bea.com / Wireless: ecobb@palm.com
> *********************************************************************
> 
> 
> 
> 
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Steve Bratt [mailto:steve@w3.org]
>>Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 6:17 AM
>>To: Ed Cobb
>>Cc: www-ws-cg@w3.org; wsi_liaison@lists.ws-i.org; team-liaisons@w3.org
>>Subject: Re: W3C/WS-I Coordination
>>
>>
>>Ed,
>>
>>This message is to request an update on how WS-I is doing in 
>>considering 
>>a liaison MOU, and whether or not WS-I is still interested in this.
>>
>>As we agreed in December, we sent to you in February our list 
>>of areas 
>>of interest.  At your request, we sent in April the generic 
>>essence of 
>>the MOU that we negotiated with OMA.  At last week's meeting 
>>of the W3C 
>>Advisory Committee, I reported that we had not heard back 
>>from WS-I on 
>>these two items.  I can appreciate how busy everyone is.  Luckily, 
>>informal technical liaising seems to work fairly well most of 
>>the time.
>>
>>Please let me know if there are any problems from your perspective.
>>
>>Best Regards,
>>
>>Steve
>>
>>------
>>
>>
>>
>>Ed Cobb wrote:
>>
>>
>>>	Steve, sorry it has taken so long to respond, but I 
>>
>>wanted to discuss this with the entire committee before doing so.
>>
>>>	If you are willing to share, we would be interested in 
>>
>>looking at the MOU you are working on with OMA to see if it 
>>might be a simpler model for WS-I to use in establishing 
>>liasion relationships with other SDOs, but we are not very 
>>enthusiastic about a collection of one-on-one different 
>>agrremsnts, all of which will require lots of legal time to 
>>produce or review. 
>>
>>>	The formal approach we have taken so far,viz. the 
>>
>>Associate Membership program was intended to provide a 
>>vehicle for the first level SDOs to have visibility into WS-I 
>>activities before they were made public to everyone. The 
>>ability to influence and change has always been more 
>>effective earlier in the process than later. Because the WS-I 
>>agreements are more restrictive then the bylaws and IPR 
>>policies of most first line SDOs, this seemed like the 
>>easiest way to proceed. 
>>
>>>	I do want to m ake it clear that WS-I is very 
>>
>>interested in maintaining our existing informal relationship, 
>>which we perceive to be very valuable and trust that you do 
>>as well, even as we explore possible ways to improve on what 
>>we already have.
>>
>>>	I've also inserted a few comments in your text below. 
>>>
>>>
>>
>>*********************************************************************
>>
>>>Edward Cobb, Vice President, Architecture & Standards
>>>BEA Systems, Inc., 2315 North First St., San Jose, CA 95131
>>>Tel: 408-570-8264 / Fax: 408-570-8914 / Mobile 408-464-0733
>>>E-mail: ed.cobb@bea.com / Wireless: ecobb@palm.com
>>>
>>
>>*********************************************************************
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: Steve Bratt [mailto:steve@w3.org]
>>>>Sent: Monday, February 23, 2004 6:17 AM
>>>>To: Ed Cobb
>>>>Cc: www-ws-cg@w3.org
>>>>Subject: W3C/WS-I Coordination
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>To Ed Cobb, Chair of WS-I Liaison Committee (from BEA)
>>>>----
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Hi Ed,
>>>>
>>>>This is in follow-up to our phone call of 2 December 2004.   
>>>>At that time, 
>>>>we agreed to consult within our organizations and compile a 
>>>>list of the key 
>>>>liaison objectives that might be better addressed under a 
>>
>>more formal 
>>
>>>>W3C/WS-I liaison arrangement, as compared to the current informal 
>>>>arrangement.   Further, we agreed that if we could identify a 
>>>>sufficient 
>>>>number objectives, we would assign one person from each side 
>>>>to develop a 
>>>>draft a liaison MOU and charter [1].
>>>>
>>>>Following consultation with our WS Coordination Group and 
>>>>Team, here is an 
>>>>initial list of objectives:
>>>>
>>>>1. Work to support inclusion of W3C Recommendations in to 
>>>>WS-I profiles, 
>>>>e.g. have them use SOAP 1.2 instead of SOAP 1.1.
>>>>
>>>
>>>There is definitely interest in doing this, but the 
>>
>>consensus today is that it would be premature since the 
>>market has had very little time to adopt SOAP 1.2 and, since 
>>the Basic Profile also deals with WSDL, WSDL 2.0 is not ready 
>>yet. We will be watching this carefully as we go forward. 
>>
>>>>2. Improve coordination of public messaging on Web services matters.
>>>>
>>>
>>>I believe there are no inpediments to doing so today and if 
>>
>>there is something specific our marketing committee could do 
>>here, I'd be happy to engage them. 
>>
>>>>3. Gain visibility into each others non-public documents and 
>>>>test suites.
>>>
>>>This is where the WS-I IPR Policy and the W3C IPR Policy 
>>
>>need to be ameliorated. The Associate Membership program was 
>>our solution to that problem. Any other solution will have to 
>>incorporate at least some of the features of Associate 
>>Membership. We look forward to seeing how you've addressed 
>>that with OMA, since I believe their IPR Policy is also very 
>>challenging.
>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>>>We are just completing an MOU with OMA that may help to 
>>>>overcome obstacles 
>>>>regarding differences in IPR and confidentiality policies 
>>
>>between our 
>>
>>>>organizations.
>>>>
>>>>Have you made progress on gathering the interests of WS-I in this 
>>>>regard?  Let's arrange another call after you send your list, 
>>>>and as soon 
>>>>as possible.
>>>>
>>>>Best Regards,
>>>>
>>>>Steve
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>[1] Liaison section of W3C process 
>>>>Document:  
>>>>http://www.w3.org/2004/02/Process-20040205/liaisons.html#Liaisons
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>-- 
>>>>Steven R Bratt, Chief Operating Officer     mailto:steve@w3.org
>>>>World Wide Web Consortium   http://www.w3.org
>>>>MIT Computer Science and Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
>>>>200 Technology Square, Room NE43-352
>>>>Cambridge, MA 02139, USA / Voice: +1.617.253.7697 / Fax: 
>>>>+1.617.258.5999
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>-- 
>>Steven R Bratt, Chief Operating Officer     mailto:steve@w3.org
>>World Wide Web Consortium   http://www.w3.org/
>>MIT Computer Science and Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
>>The Stata Center / Building 32-G522 / 32 Vassar Street
>>Cambridge, MA 02139, USA / Voice: +1.617.253.7697 / Fax: 
>>+1.617.258.5999
>>
> 
> 

-- 
Steven R Bratt, Chief Operating Officer     mailto:steve@w3.org
World Wide Web Consortium   http://www.w3.org/
MIT Computer Science and Artificial Intelligence Laboratory
The Stata Center / Building 32-G522 / 32 Vassar Street
Cambridge, MA 02139, USA / Voice: +1.617.253.7697 / Fax: +1.617.258.5999
Received on Monday, 7 June 2004 20:40:33 GMT

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