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Re: [ws-chor] 4/29/2003: Updated Glossary of Terms

From: Francis McCabe <fgm@fla.fujitsu.com>
Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 10:26:53 -0700
Cc: "Monica J. Martin" <monica.martin@sun.com>, <member-ws-chor@w3.org>, <www-ws-arch@w3.org>
To: "Martin Chapman" <martin.chapman@oracle.com>
Message-Id: <4404F003-7CC3-11D7-99AC-000393A3327C@fla.fujitsu.com>

Well, I can see that that might end up being the consensus :-)

However, some points:

1. It is not obvious that there is a distinction between the overall  
pov and an individual party's pov; i.e., it is not obvious that two  
words are required for this distinction.

2. There is still the need for defining the term for the mechanism that  
ensures a choreography happens: whether it is by means of a central  
controller or individual code choices makes no difference

3. My definition of orchestration did not actually state that the  
mechanism had to be centralized.

4. I did not intend to imply a value-judgement that choreographies had  
to be centrally managed.

However, my mission is not to impose will but to write text; and we  
need something in the WSA that is better than is currently there.

Frank



On Friday, May 2, 2003, at 10:02  AM, Martin Chapman wrote:

> No sure I buy the orchestration defintion. The text implies  
> enforcement to a
> choreography or some policing of a choreography.
> This seems to contrast with what I see, in that choreography and
> orchestration are different flavours of defining patterns of  
> interactions.
> Although there is no consenus of these flavours, it seems the general
> direction
> is to view orchestration as a defintion from a single single party's  
> point
> of
> view (the conductor) and choregraphy is a defintion of a shared point  
> of
> view
> (i.e. no central controller).
>
>
> Martin.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Francis McCabe [mailto:fgm@fla.fujitsu.com]
> Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 9:10 AM
> To: Monica J. Martin
> Cc: Martin Chapman; member-ws-chor@w3.org; www-ws-arch@w3.org
> Subject: Re: [ws-chor] 4/29/2003: Updated Glossary of Terms
>
>
> Since we are currently editing the WSA spec, we need a placeholder for
> the notions of Choreography and probably orchestration.
>
> I propose the following:
>
> Choreography:
>
> The pattern of interactions, expressed as a pattern of types of
> messages, between a set of service requestors and providers. A
> description of a choreography may include a description of the
> necessary states that give rise to the particular message patterns.
>
> In contract, Orchestration would be:
>
> A mechanism for ensuring that a set of service providers and requestors
> exchange messages in accordance to a choreography.
>
> We would appreciate comments on these definitions, as a new heart-beat
> spec will be published shortly.
>
> Of course, if WS-CHOR comes to consensus on these terms, the WSA will
> be updated acccordingly.
>
> Frank McCabe
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, April 29, 2003, at 12:46  PM, Monica J. Martin wrote:
>
>> Everyone,
>> Sorry for a delay. Here are the updated terms in an Excel .xls. I've
>> added columns as we work through the definitions (normative or
>> informative) we wish to use.
>> In comments column, we have open questions. We also can discuss which
>> terms are currently seen in scope for WS-Chor and others that may be
>> TBD as we flesh through the requirements.
>>
>> I hope this is a good start - it takes all comments received (Hugo,
>> Cummins, Arkin, Dart, believe that is it......).
>>
>> Thanks.
>> Monica
>> Martin Chapman wrote:
>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> Martin Chapman                                 500 Oracle Parkway
>>> Consulting Member of Technical Staff           Ms 4op990
>>> Oracle                                         Redwood Shores,
>>> P: +1 650 506 6941                             CA 94065
>>> e: martin.chapman@oracle.com                   USA
>>>
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>> -
>>> --
>>>
>>> *W3C Web Services Choreography Working Group weekly conference call*
>>>
>>> * *
>>>
>>> *29^nd  April 2003*
>>>
>>> *AGENDA*
>>>
>>> Dial in information (members only):
>>> http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/chor/admin#meetings**
>>>
>>> *1.            **Role Call*
>>>
>>> *2.            **Confirm scribe*
>>>
>>> The following is a list of recent scribes (in order): Abbie Barbir,
>>> David Burdett, John Dart, Carol MacDonald, Yaron Goland, Daniel
>>> Austin, Jim Hendler,  Peter Furniss, Ed Peters, Greg Ritzinger,
>>> Leonard Greski
>>>
>>> *3.            **Approve minute
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *
>>>
>>> *4.            ** *
>>>
>>> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-ws-chor/2003Apr/att-0039/
>>> 20030422-1.html
>>>
>>> *5.            **Action Item Review*
>>>
>>> Hugo Haas: Creation of editors mailing list is in progress due to be
>>> complete by the end of the week :
>>>
>>> Possible hosting of a future face 2 face meeting on the East Coast by
>>> Novel, Sun and Sonic respectively.
>>>
>>> SRT will prepare list of places for harvesting use cases and send
>>> list to WG list
>>>
>>> (recorded in http://www.w3.org/2003/04/08-ws-chor-irc#T20-41-43 )
>>>
>>> Chairs to compose list of tasks for a call for SME volunteers in next
>>> week's call
>>>
>>> (recorded in http://www.w3.org/2003/04/08-ws-chor-irc#T20-42-02)
>>>
>>> All: Review requirements document and provide feedback to editors.
>>> http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/chor/reqs/2003/04/WD-ws-chor-requirements-
>>> 20030414.html
>>>
>>>
>>> All: Everyone should read the CSF(critical success factors) part of
>>> the WSA spec to understand what it is about.
>>> http://www.w3.org/TR/wsa-reqs
>>>
>>>
>>> * *
>>>
>>> *6.            **Focus for the next 6 months (continued from last
>>> week)*
>>>
>>> *a.                   **Other deliverables*
>>>
>>> *1.                         **Base line specifications*
>>>
>>> *2.                         **Intermediate specifications*
>>>
>>> *3.                         **Testcases*
>>>
>>> *4.                         **Generators*
>>>
>>> *[note from chair: In the absence of other input I have picked the
>>> first two topics that were on last weeks agenda which we didnít get
>>> to]*
>>>
>>> *7.            **Reusable choreographies and data formats (deferred
>>> from last week)*
>>>
>>> *8.            **Choreography storage and retrieval (hot topic from
>>> the public mailing list)*
>>>
>>> *a.                   **What do we search on?*
>>>
>>> *b.                  **Dealing with incomplete information?***
>>>
>>> *c.                   **The role of rules?***
>>>
>>> *9.            **Dynamically changing participants in a choreography
>>> (hot topic from public mailing list)*
>>>
>>> *10.        **Formal models and choreography (hot topic from public
>>> mailing list)*
>>>
>>> *a.                   **The value of the value of the pi-calculus*
>>>
>>> *b.                  **What about petrinets*
>>>
>>> *c.                   **What is a process (hot topic from the mailing
>>> list)*
>>>
>>> *11.        **AOB.*
>>>
>>> * *
>>>
>>
>> <WS-ChorMatrixTerms_mm2_042903.xls>
>
>
Received on Friday, 2 May 2003 13:27:13 GMT

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