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Re: Minutes for August 11 Telcon

From: ashok malhotra <ashok.malhotra@oracle.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2011 11:31:34 -0700
Message-ID: <4E46C306.7030903@oracle.com>
To: Jonathan Rees <jar@creativecommons.org>
CC: "www-tag@w3.org" <www-tag@w3.org>
Thank you, Jonathan!
We should discuss how to make the Wiki better
and see if we can get some security experts to
add material.
All the best, Ashok

On 8/13/2011 11:22 AM, Jonathan Rees wrote:
> Thanks. I think you meant to say "are at
> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/08/11-minutes"
>
> I took the liberty of editing the minutes file to hyperlink the
> question "Don't we already have a security wiki?"
> to the following:  http://www.w3.org/Security/wiki/Main_Page
> I didn't have the link handy during the meeting but there it is.
>
> The answer seems to be yes.
>
> Jonathan
>
> On Sat, Aug 13, 2011 at 1:52 PM, ashok malhotra
> <ashok.malhotra@oracle.com>  wrote:
>> Minutes for August 11 Telcon are at Minutes for August 11 Telcon
>> and in text below.
>>
>> [1]W3C
>>
>>       [1] http://www.w3.org/
>>
>>                                - DRAFT -
>>
>>                               TAG Weekly
>>
>> 11 Aug 2011
>>
>>    [2]Agenda
>>
>>       [2] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/08/11-agenda
>>
>>    See also: [3]IRC log
>>
>>       [3] http://www.w3.org/2011/08/11-tagmem-irc
>>
>> Attendees
>>
>>    Present
>>           Jonathan_Rees, Peter_Linss, Ashok_Malhotra, Henry_Thompson,
>>           Noah_Mendelsohn
>>
>>    Regrets
>>           TimBl, Jeni_Tennison, Dan_Appelquist, Larry_Masinter
>>
>>    Chair
>>           Noah Mendelsohn
>>
>>    Scribe
>>           Ashok
>>
>> Contents
>>
>>      * [4]Topics
>>          1. [5]Convene
>>          2. [6]Administrative
>>          3. [7]Planning for Sept. 2011 F2F
>>          4. [8]Overdue Actions
>>          5. [9]Telcons in August
>>      * [10]Summary of Action Items
>>      _________________________________________________________
>>
>>    <scribe>    scribe: Ashok
>>
>>    <scribe>    Scribenick: Ashok
>>
>> Convene
>>
>>    Approval of minutes
>>
>>    <noah>    14 July: [11]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/08/11-agenda
>>
>>      [11] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/08/11-agenda
>>
>>    Minutes appoved without objection
>>
>>    <noah>    12 July 2011:
>>    [12]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/07/21-minutes
>>
>>      [12] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/07/21-minutes
>>
>>    Minutes appoved without objection
>>
>>    <noah>    4 August 2011:
>>    [13]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/08/04-minutes
>>
>>      [13] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/08/04-minutes
>>
>>    Minutes appoved without objection
>>
>> Administrative
>>
>>    Discussion of f2f in Edinburgh
>>
>>    <noah>    HT: We can add other people to the hotel reservation. Contact
>>    me if you want me to reserve for you.
>>
>>    <noah>    HT: If you can't reach Henry, contact Noah
>>
>> Planning for Sept. 2011 F2F
>>
>>    JAR: Manu will send mail re. microdata
>>
>> Overdue Actions
>>
>>    <noah>    Sorted by owner:
>>    [14]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/overdue?sort=owne
>>    r
>>
>>      [14] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/overdue?sort=owner
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-566?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-566 -- Daniel Appelquist to contact Alissa Cooper,
>>    organize a future joint discussion on privacy with IAB. -- due
>>    2011-07-19 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [15]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/566
>>
>>      [15] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/566
>>
>>    Noah: We should continue to liaise with IAB -- keep Thomas in loop
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: And Yves, of course
>>
>>    Noah: and PLH
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Our liaisons are Thomas and Philippe
>>
>>    <noah>    YL: Yes
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: What to do about privacy at the Sept. F2F?
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Noah, you had asked us to look at Do Not Track working
>>    group charter.
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: I didn't manage to sync up with Dan
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Product page shows Privacy Friendly Web (early draft of
>>    report product page needed) Daniel Appelquist, Ashok Malhotra
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: No specific product page, but this:
>>    [16]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/products/PrivacyFriendlyWeb.html
>>
>>      [16] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/products/PrivacyFriendlyWeb.html
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-583?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-583 -- Ashok Malhotra to (with help from Dan)
>>    organize TAG review of proposed W3C charter on tracking protection
>>    (privacy) Due 2011-07-26 -- due 2011-07-21 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [17]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/583
>>
>>      [17] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/583
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Not sure what TAG can contribute now, given formation of
>>    working group.
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Working group is mostly scoped to Do Not Track?
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Yes
>>
>>    <jar>    [18]http://www.w3.org/2011/07/privacy-ig-charter
>>
>>      [18] http://www.w3.org/2011/07/privacy-ig-charter
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Larry had suggested a threat model, and from it derive
>>    weaknesses. Maybe we're too late to do that.
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Jonathan, that's the IG charter.
>>
>>    <jar>
>>    [19]http://www.w3.org/2011/tracking-protection/charter-draft.html
>>
>>      [19] http://www.w3.org/2011/tracking-protection/charter-draft.html
>>
>>    Noah: The privacy-fiendly web does not have a product page
>>    ... at the f2f we can have a short discussion of whether we should
>>    do future work in this area
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Propose at minimum a short F2F discussion of deciding
>>    whether we have a "product" in the privacy area, and if so with what
>>    scope goals, etc. If someone prepares a more detailed report, we
>>    could review that.
>>
>>    HT: Registers modest amount of scepticism about this area
>>
>>    <noah>    HT: Worried about lack of TAG background and skill set.
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Was about to agree with you. Not worth the time unless
>>    someone steps up and says "think about thus and so...". Haven't
>>    heard that.
>>
>>    JAR: Agrees with HT. I'm missing a framework.
>>
>>    Noah: We can explain to people the expectations they should have
>>    when using the Web
>>    ... we could make a contribution along those lines for privacy.
>>
>>    <jar>    You're talking about security, not privacy, Noah
>>
>>    Noah: Educate people about privacy on the Web
>>
>>    JAR: Framework will not come from us
>>
>>    <jar>    This group is not going to originate any high level ideas on
>>    privacy
>>
>>    Noah: Should we spend half an hour on this?
>>
>>    jar: Only if someone has something to bring to the table
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Scope of F2F, whether to keep working in this area.
>>
>>    Ashok: Half an hour at most
>>
>>    Noah: Discusses with HT re. Interaction for Web Apps
>>
>>    jar: Dan was going to work on it
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-341?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-341 -- Yves Lafon to follow up with Thomas about
>>    security review activities for HTML5 -- due 2011-05-10 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [20]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/341
>>
>>      [20] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/341
>>
>>    Yves: I will check with Thomas
>>
>>    <noah>    also ACTION-516?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-516 -- Yves Lafon to talk with Thomas Roessler
>>    about organizing W3C architecture work on security -- due 2011-07-19
>>    -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [21]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/516
>>
>>      [21] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/516
>>
>>    Yves: Charter being discussed
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Do we want F2F discussion on security
>>
>>    <noah>    YL: Yes.
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: What scope
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-515?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-515 -- Larry Masinter to (as trackbot proxy for
>>    John) who will publish
>>    [22]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/02/security-web.html, slightly
>>    cleaned up, with help from Noah and Larry -- due 2011-07-30 -- OPEN
>>
>>      [22] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2011/02/security-web.html
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [23]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/515
>>
>>      [23] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/515
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Discusion of security wiki
>>
>>    <jar>    Don't we already have a security wiki?
>>
>>    <jar>    Maybe it's just a cors/ump wiki.
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Scope is, once again, what should the TAG do about
>>    security
>>
>>    HT: Need someone to bring something to the table
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: So probably a security session, but with concern about
>>    spinning wheels
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-554?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-554 -- Noah Mendelsohn to formulate product page
>>    for TAG work on security including John Kemp security draft Due:
>>    2011-05-24 -- due 2011-08-16 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [24]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/554
>>
>>      [24] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/554
>>
>>    <noah>    Email from Tobias Gondrum:
>>    [25]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2011Aug/0026.html
>>
>>      [25] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2011Aug/0026.html
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: He is chair of one of the working groups
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-572?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-572 -- Yves Lafon to look at appcache in HTML5 --
>>    due 2011-07-29 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [26]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/572
>>
>>      [26] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/572
>>
>>    Yves: keep open so we can discuss
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-572 PENDING REVIEW
>>
>>    Noah: Suggest we wait for Dan ... pending review ... not worth f2f
>>    time
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-519?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-519 -- Peter Linss to frame architectural
>>    opportunities relating to scalability of resource access -- due
>>    2011-08-02 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [27]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/519
>>
>>      [27] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/519
>>
>>    Peter: I have not had time to work on this
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-519 Due: 2011-10-18
>>
>>    Noah: Should we pick a date like mid-October ... how about Oct 18?
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-519 Due 2011-10-18
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-519 Frame architectural opportunities relating to
>>    scalability of resource access due date now 2011-10-18
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-583?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-583 -- Ashok Malhotra to (with help from Dan)
>>    organize TAG review of proposed W3C charter on tracking protection
>>    (privacy) Due 2011-07-26 -- due 2011-07-21 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [28]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/583
>>
>>      [28] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/583
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-523?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-523 -- Ashok Malhotra to (with help from Noah)
>>    build good product page for client storage finding, identifying top
>>    questions to be answered on client side storage -- due 2011-04-05 --
>>    OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [29]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/523
>>
>>      [29] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/523
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Should we close ACTION-583, given that charter is out
>>    now?
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Why not comment now if there are problems?
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: OK, I sent email to Dan, I can let the rest of you take a
>>    look
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Please let me know if you think this should be part of
>>    F2F discussion.
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-583 Due 2011-08-30
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-583 (with help from Dan) organize TAG review of
>>    proposed W3C charter on tracking protection (privacy) Due 2011-07-26
>>    due date now 2011-08-30
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-523?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-523 -- Ashok Malhotra to (with help from Noah)
>>    build good product page for client storage finding, identifying top
>>    questions to be answered on client side storage -- due 2011-04-05 --
>>    OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [30]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/523
>>
>>      [30] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/523
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: I think we should wait on this, discuss briefly at the
>>    F2F. Discuss where we're going.
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: If we're going to have F2F discussion, I'd like a draft
>>    product page as input
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: I'm actually having trouble figuring out what matters
>>    here.
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: OK, then maybe we do need technical discussion
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-523?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-523 -- Ashok Malhotra to (with help from Noah)
>>    build good product page for client storage finding, identifying top
>>    questions to be answered on client side storage -- due 2011-04-05 --
>>    OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [31]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/523
>>
>>      [31] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/523
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-523 Due 2011-08-30
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-523 (with help from Noah) build good product page
>>    for client storage finding, identifying top questions to be answered
>>    on client side storage due date now 2011-08-30
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-574?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-574 -- Ashok Malhotra to review
>>    [32]http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hammer-hostmeta/?include_t
>>    ext=1 in preparation for TAG review Due 2011-07-12 -- due 2011-06-30
>>    -- OPEN
>>
>>      [32]
>> http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hammer-hostmeta/?include_text=1
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [33]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/574
>>
>>      [33] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/574
>>
>>    <noah>    AM: Jonathan and I took a look, turned out we didn't have a
>>    lot to say. I think spec is mature. We should close the action.
>>    Jonathan?
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: Not swapped in.
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: Ah, host meta.
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: Long ago, Sandro raised question of XML vs. RDF. I don't
>>    feel that strongly.
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: Does relate to work on definition discovery.
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Close the action, as Ashok suggests?
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: Yes, without implying feedback pro or con
>>
>>    <noah>    close ACTION-574
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-574 Review
>>    [34]http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hammer-hostmeta/?include_t
>>    ext=1 in preparation for TAG review Due 2011-07-12 closed
>>
>>      [34]
>> http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-hammer-hostmeta/?include_text=1
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-472?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-472 -- Larry Masinter to update the mime-draft
>>    based on comments&    review -- due 2011-07-30 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [35]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/472
>>
>>      [35] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/472
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Do we know if he wants to ramp down TAG's part of the
>>    work?
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: My impression is he wants discussion, if only to figure
>>    next steps.
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Note product page
>>    [36]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/products/mimeweb.html is high
>>    priority. So we at least need to explicitly declare success/failure,
>>    etc.
>>
>>      [36] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/products/mimeweb.html
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: We WILL discuss at F2F
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-531?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-531 -- Larry Masinter to draft document on
>>    architectural good practice relating to registries -- due 2011-07-30
>>    -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [37]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/531
>>
>>      [37] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/531
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Same answer?
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: Yes.
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-509?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-509 -- Jonathan Rees to communicate with RDFa WG
>>    regarding documenting the fragid / media type issue -- due
>>    2011-06-15 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [38]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/509
>>
>>      [38] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/509
>>
>>    jar: My recommendation is to remove the words "at present"
>>
>>    <jar>
>>    [39]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2011Jun/0113.html
>>
>>      [39] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2011Jun/0113.html
>>
>>    <noah>     From their draft:
>>
>>    <noah>    "In some of the examples below we have used IRIs with
>>    fragment identifiers that are local to the document containing the
>>    RDFa fragment identifiers shown (e.g., 'about="#me"'). This idiom,
>>    which is also used in RDF/XML [RDF-SYNTAX-GRAMMAR] and other RDF
>>    serializations, gives a simple way to 'mint' new IRIs for entities
>>    described by RDFa and therefore contributes considerably to the
>>    expressive power of RDFa. Unfortunately, this practice is not at
>>    present cover
>>
>>    jar: I suggested 4 options
>>
>>    <noah>    HT: Fussing with the wording before settling the
>>    architectural issue isn't necessarily the best course. Not that I
>>    will necessarily understand the architectural issue, and I have
>>    taken some responsibility for moving on the larger cluster of
>>    fragid-related issues.
>>
>>    Noah: shall we bump the due date and cross-reference with other
>>    frag-id issue
>>
>>    HT: Cross-reference with product page
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: The ACTION is on the fragid product page. Bump the date
>>    and move on?
>>
>>    HT: We should discuss at f2f
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-509 Due 2011-09-15
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-509 Communicate with RDFa WG regarding documenting
>>    the fragid / media type issue due date now 2011-09-15
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-478?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-478 -- Jonathan Rees to prepare a second draft of
>>    a finding on persistence of references, to be based on decision tree
>>    from Oct. 2010 F2F -- due 2011-08-09 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [40]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/478
>>
>>      [40] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/478
>>
>>    <jar>    for the record jar favors (b) remove "at present" - it's a
>>    hedge, and has the virtue of removing the implicit promise of future
>>    work
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: Still intend to work on ACTION-478
>>
>>    <noah>    Jonathan, will you just let me know later whether you favor a
>>    F2F slot?
>>
>>    Noah: We don't have a product page for this
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Worth doing product page now?
>>
>>    <noah>    NM: Could clarify what we're about.
>>
>>    <noah>    JAR: Could do at the F2F
>>
>>    Noah: should we think about that or just continue with technical
>>    work
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-576?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-576 -- Jonathan Rees to with help from Henry to
>>    figure out impact of RDFa core on generic fragids story, especially
>>    in 3023bis Due 2011-7-12 -- due 2011-06-30 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [41]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/576
>>
>>      [41] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/576
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-541?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-541 -- Jeni Tennison to helped by DKA to produce a
>>    first draft of terminology about (deep-)linking etc. -- due
>>    2011-07-26 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [42]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/541
>>
>>      [42] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/541
>>
>>    <noah>    Noah to find Jeni and/or Dan to figure out whether ACTION-541
>>    needs time at the F2F
>>
>>    <noah>    HT: We need to do something that gets into the public media
>>
>>    Noah: Something that gets published
>>
>>    <noah>    Note, that we have a June 2012 target for a W3C Proposed
>>    Recommendation. Does that work?
>>
>>    HT: Educate people about linking
>>
>>    Noah: For the media we need something pithy
>>
>>    <noah>
>>    [43]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/overdue?sort=owne
>>    r
>>
>>      [43] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/overdue?sort=owner
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-560?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-560 -- Henry Thompson to review HTML polyglot last
>>    call Due 2011-06-06 -- due 2011-06-02 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [44]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/560
>>
>>      [44] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/560
>>
>>    <noah>    ACTION-528?
>>
>>    <trackbot>    ACTION-528 -- Henry Thompson to create and get consensus
>>    on a product page and tracker product page for persistence of names
>>    -- due 2011-08-10 -- OPEN
>>
>>    <trackbot>    [45]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/528
>>
>>      [45] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/group/track/actions/528
>>
>>    <noah>    HT: We've talked about 528
>>
>>    <noah>    HT: Aside from things already (fragids and persistence of
>>    domains) nothing for me at the F2F
>>
>>    HT: Nothing that else will come up at f2f ... we have discussed
>>    frag-ids and persistence of identifiers
>>
>>    Ashok: I will work on Client-Side state draft
>>
>> Telcons in August
>>
>>    HT: Cannot do telcon next week
>>
>>    Noah: I will send mail re. future telcons
>>
>> Summary of Action Items
>>
>>    [End of minutes]
>>
>>
>> --
>> All the best, Ashok
>>
>>
Received on Saturday, 13 August 2011 18:32:09 GMT

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