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TAG minutes 21 May for review (NamespaceState-48, XMLVersioning-41, namespaceDocument-8, ...)

From: Dan Connolly <connolly@w3.org>
Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 12:35:36 -0500
To: www-tag@w3.org
Message-Id: <1179768936.15441.128.camel@pav.dm93.org>

hypertext: http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes

plain text follows...

                              TAG Weekly

21 May 2007

   See also: [2]IRC log

      [2] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-irc

Attendees

   Present
          TimBL, Stuart, Ht, Raman, DanC, noah, Norm

   Regrets
          dorchard, rhys

   Chair
          SKW

   Scribe
          DanC

Contents

     * [3]Topics
         1. [4]Administrative (Convene, review records and agenda)
         2. [5]May F2F Preparation
         3. [6]NamespaceState-48
         4. [7]XMLVersioning-41
         5. [8]XTech debrief
         6. [9]WWW2007 debrief
         7. [10]issue namespaceDocument-8
     * [11]Summary of Action Items
     _________________________________________________________

Administrative (Convene, review records and agenda)

   <DanC_> [12]minutes 14 May

     [12] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2007/05/14-minutes.html

   RESOLUTION: to approve minutes 14 May

   RESOLUTION: our Next Telcon is 11th June -- scribe: Raman.

   re Check on Rhys' write access to TAG space - has that been
   resolved? ... SKW and DC did a bit about that.

May F2F Preparation

   TVR gives some logistics advice...

   TBL: I'll be joining the rest of you a bit later on the 1st morning

   <DanC_> [13]agenda of Mountain View meeting

     [13] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2007/05/29-agenda

   HT: re 5 to 6pm, I doubt it.

   DC: as scribing over breakfast is challenging, pls move
   administrative stuff elsewhere

   SKW: purpose and direction might include our web presence

   HT: purpose and direction seems like a good use of time, but better
   later in the meeting

   <Zakim> noah, you wanted to ask about putting all of versioning
   together

   NM: re versioning... how about moving some of it to day 1, to let it
   percolate

   <DanC_> (mild preference for moving some versioning as NM suggests)

   SKW: DanC, you asked for "HTML Design Principles and Web
   Architecture", what's the/a goal? do you want to lead it?

   DanC: I'm not sure whether those design principles are increasing or
   decreasing in importance

   HT: if there's no other place to ask whether /TR/webarch/ is too
   strong in its position on version identification, then we need this

   NM, TVR added some that the scribe missed; the chair seemed content
   to move on... scribe hopes this record has what everybody needs.

   NM: there's enough diversity of opinion that it might be worth
   having a level-setting session

   DC: I'm inclined to have the level-setting happen as an executive
   decision rather than discussing it as a group

   SKW: I'm inclined to discuss tactics as a group

   SKW collects further advice on the ftf agenda; updates to appear

NamespaceState-48

   SKW: we published a /TR/ over a year ago...
   ... there's some interaction with patent policy mechanics

   <timbl> which doc?

   <Stuart> [14]http://www.w3.org/TR/namespaceState/

     [14] http://www.w3.org/TR/namespaceState/

   <DanC_> [15]The Disposition of Names in an XML Namespace

     [15] http://www.w3.org/TR/namespaceState/

   DanC: I suggest end-of-life-ing it as a WG Note

   SKW: how does one do that?

   DanC: just write a new status-of-this-document and ask the webmaster

   <scribe> ACTION: SKW to discuss with NDW moving /TR/namespaceState/
   to WG Note [recorded in
   [16]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action01]

     [16] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action01

XMLVersioning-41

   SKW: so we have an update from DO, in 3 parts

   <scribe> ACTION: DanC Review definitions of partial understanding,
   backward compatible, and forward compatible. [CONTINUES] [recorded
   in [17]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action02]

     [17] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action02

   DanC: I'm disappointed that the document is going in the opposite of
   the direction I advised, which was to integrate the definitions into
   the material so that they're motivated

   <Stuart> [18]http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/actions#XMLVersioning-41

     [18] http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/actions#XMLVersioning-41

   NM: I sent some comments on previous drafts [a pointer would be
   nifty]. Some of my comments have been addressed, some not. I'm
   interested in views from others.

   SKW: I plan to [missed]

   <scribe> ACTION: HT to extend his paper (around Vancouver) to a
   definition of monotonicity and its relevance to our versioning
   finding. [CONTINUES] [recorded in
   [19]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action03]

     [19] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action03

   HT: I don't expect to make progress before this coming ftf meeting

   SKW: re "ACTION NDW: Produce some information about NVDL for the
   finding." ... what's NVDL?

   HT: NVDL is a standard in progress in ISO... multiple namespace ...

   <scribe> (in progress?)

   <scribe> ACTION: NDW to Produce some information about NVDL for the
   finding. [CONTINUES] [recorded in
   [20]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action04]

     [20] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action04

   <scribe> ACTION: HT to unearth thread in which he and Robin Berjon
   discussed XML versioning [CONTINUES] [recorded in
   [21]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action05]

     [21] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action05

   <scribe> ACTION: DO to produce revised Versioning-part1 and
   Versioning-XML for May 18th [DONE] [recorded in
   [22]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action06]

     [22] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action06

XTech debrief

   SKW: just HT from the TAG went to this conference?

   HT: yes. XTech has some history in SGML Europe, XML Europe. Edd
   Dumbill (sp?) has moved the "center of gravity" to web
   2.0/browsers/etc.
   ... ~200 attendees
   ... tracks were: core technologies (least attended), browsers, open
   data (most attended), and one other
   ... Dave Beckett gave a very good talk on non-XML text formats.
   ... he had some very trenchant [?] criticisms of them
   ... YAML spec, which was aimed at being simpler than XML, is now 3x
   as long
   ... I went to Henri S.'s talk on conformance checking HTML 5...
   ... follow-up discussion... "you've written this cool checker based
   on grammars and such; how about getting the WG to adapt these
   grammars?"
   ... to which the response was [something like] "but then there would
   be a risk of conflicting definitions of the language" and such
   ... I had a good discussion with Anne, who's doing a thesis on an
   HTML5 processor... I just had a "making HTML tag soup declarative"
   paper accepted; so we agreed to exchange notes

   NM: a colleague of mine is working on Operator, a firefox extension
   that handled calendar/contact microformats. EliasT announced, at
   XTech, support in Operator for RDFa too.

   <timbl> What about a RDF/XML , or an GRDDL plugin for Operator?

WWW2007 debrief

   <DanC_> [23]Linked Data at WWW2007: GRDDL, SPARQL, and Wikipedia, oh
   my!

     [23] http://dig.csail.mit.edu/breadcrumbs/node/194

   SKW sorta adjourned the meeting, or at least excused those who wish
   to go... so scribing here is light

   <Stuart> well I sorta suggested that we might, but I didn't actually
   call "adjourned" and folks seemed to stay.

issue namespaceDocument-8

   NDW: so picking up from previous ftf...
   . Subject: Describing the "nature" of a resource Date: Wed, 16 May
   2007 16:37:58 -0400

   NDW: Dan, did you follow?

   DanC: well, sorta... but the direction is different from what I was
   interested to see; I'm interested to start from extant RDDL
   documents and see what they're trying to do. e.g. how does someone
   exploit "... rddl:nature HTML4"?

   NDW: that's a different approach

   <Stuart> N3 and RDF/XML content negotiated?

   SKW: I'm a little lost... I picked up on a tangent about resources
   and representations

   TBL: can we look at this as generic resources? is there the case of
   RNG and XSD schemas that convey the same information? they have
   different natures?

   NDW: yes, e.g. docbook.rng vs docbook.xsd

   TBL: these are resources that typically have just one
   representation.

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: SKW to discuss with NDW moving /TR/namespaceState/ to
   WG Note [recorded in
   [24]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action01]

     [24] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action01

   [PENDING] ACTION: DanC Review definitions of partial understanding,
   backward compatible, and forward compatible. [recorded in
   [25]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action02]
   [PENDING] ACTION: HT to extend his paper (around Vancouver) to a
   definition of monotonicity and its relevance to our versioning
   finding. [recorded in
   [26]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action03]
   [PENDING] ACTION: HT to unearth thread in which he and Robin Berjon
   discussed XML versioning [recorded in
   [27]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action05]
   [PENDING] ACTION: NDW to Produce some information about NVDL for the
   finding. [recorded in
   [28]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action04]

     [25] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action02
     [26] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action03
     [27] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action05
     [28] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action04

   [DONE] ACTION: DO to produce revised Versioning-part1 and
   Versioning-XML for May 18th [recorded in
   [29]http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action06]

     [29] http://www.w3.org/2007/05/21-tagmem-minutes.html#action06

   [End of minutes]
     _________________________________________________________


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-- 
Dan Connolly, W3C http://www.w3.org/People/Connolly/
Received on Monday, 21 May 2007 17:35:40 GMT

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