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Minutes, 16 Feb 2011 SVG WG telcon

From: Anthony Grasso <Anthony.Grasso@cisra.canon.com.au>
Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 20:50:35 +0000
To: W3C SVG Comments List <www-svg@w3.org>
Message-ID: <923A4276C1903646BE5299CA8462B0A01749E4CC@exm01-wvp.cisra.canon.com.au>
http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-minutes.html


---

   [1]W3C

      [1] http://www.w3.org/


                               - DRAFT -

                   SVG Working Group Teleconference

16 Feb 2011

   [2]Agenda

      [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMar/0142.html


   See also: [3]IRC log

      [3] http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-irc


Attendees

   Present
          Doug_Schepers, anthony_work, [IPcaller], ed, heycam, ChrisL,
          tbah, adrianba

   Regrets
   Chair
          Cameron

   Scribe
          anthony

Contents

     * [4]Topics
         1. [5]Face-to-face
         2. [6]Status update on SVG 1.1 2nd Edition
         3. [7]SVG in HTML
         4. [8]Marker and Colour
         5. [9]Review of Progress Events
     * [10]Summary of Action Items
     _________________________________________________________

   <trackbot> Date: 16 February 2011

   <scribe> Scribe: anthony

   <scribe> ScribeNick: anthony

Face-to-face

   CM: Today's telcon will probably the last before the face-to-face
   ... people may be travelling next week

   <heycam>
   [11]http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/wiki/F2F/Auckland_2011/Agenda


     [11] http://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/wiki/F2F/Auckland_2011/Agenda


   CM: so we will cancel next weeks
   ... wanted to check if people had noticed anything missing from the
   agenda

   DS: Did you get confirmation from Dean that he can come?

   CM: I got confirmation that he can't come
   ... he's stuck in the USA
   ... for another week
   ... Dean said he was thinking about some APIs for some Animation
   ... and he may send it through

   ED: About the Animations
   ... if there are questions and topics, I can forward those to people
   in Opera

   CM: I plan to start hashing out some Animation stuff on the Wiki

   DS: Brian will be there right?

   CM: Yes, he'll stick some stuff up on that page
   ... he's going to be focusing on fixing SMIL stuff in SVG rather
   than harmonisation

   DS: Not going to be there on Monday until noon

   CM: Fujisawa-san is going to be there Monday - Wednesday
   ... and Alex Danilo will be there Wednesday - Friday
   ... If you have time to stick stuff up on the Wiki please do so by
   Monday

   CL: I think it's really good that the chairs are doing this work
   prior to the meeting

   ED: I think it will help to get the agenda sorted out before the
   meeting starts

   CM: I think we will discuss that over the next few days
   ... if there is anything that we've missed, stick it up and let us
   know

Status update on SVG 1.1 2nd Edition

   CM: For my part I haven't been able to find any time
   ... to fix Batik up for any test failures
   ... I started looking at one
   ... there are 19 tests that are marked as less than two passes
   ... a few telcons ago we assigned actions to people asked them to
   look at their implementations
   ... not sure if that is all we needed to do

   ED: I haven't had time to look at the actions I took for that
   ... I do know we have a couple of those failing tests in internal
   builds

   CM: I can't really guarantee that I'll have stuff fixed before the
   face-to-face

   DS: My take on this less than two passes is it isn't supported well
   ... and we shouldn't include it

   CM: Do we remove the feature then?

   CL: One option is to say it is not defined
   ... there is also a class of things that we are saying are defined
   but we don't test
   ... in CSS is that is

   DS: There are a lot of things that are good in the spec that are not
   implemented
   ... and we can resolve some of these things in SVG 2
   ... so we could change 'must' to 'should'
   ... but it's a lot of trouble
   ... I think it would take a lot of work to do
   ... we can do that in the frame of SVG 2
   ... even though I don't like the idea of features untested

   CM: I feel like we've gone that set of tests to determine if we can
   get passes on them
   ... but we haven't decided if we would drop them
   ... I get the feeling that it's going to be pretty hard to get those
   done as fix ups
   ... If we want to get things done by the face-to-face not sure if we
   will have time
   ... Should we leave deciding what to do with the test to the
   face-to-face?

   CL: If it's something that we can fix in SVG 2 then we can leave it
   until then
   ... then if it is something fundamental to the specification
   ... then we should push implementations to fix it

   CM: That's what worries me the most
   ... is features not being implemented
   ... that are important
   ... it could be one of those case that it is a bit tricky and
   provides marginal value

   DS: I think we should keep in mind that once we complete SVG 1.1 2nd
   edition
   ... doesn't mean that we won't make a 3rd edition
   ... so if we think there is the slightest ambiguity about a test
   ... we should mark it for SVG 1.1 3rd edition or SVG
   ... 2

   ED: We could mark the parts of tests that are not passing
   ... I had a couple of actions to do that
   ... but it doesn't cover all of the tests remaining

   DS: Historically going through tests during the face-to-face
   ... is time consuming
   ... and we have a pretty full agenda
   ... we should try to talk about this over email

   CL: I think we should have a Wiki page with the tests
   ... and have reasons for dropping certain tests

   CM: I will create a page after the call
   ... and put my initial opinions up
   ... and we'll see what comes out of that

   <scribe> ACTION: Cameron to Create a Wiki page listing the current
   tests that have less that 2 passes in SVG 1.1 2nd edition [recorded
   in [12]http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-minutes.html#action01]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-2960 - Create a Wiki page listing the
   current tests that have less that 2 passes in SVG 1.1 2nd edition
   [on Cameron McCormack - due 2011-02-23].

   <tbah> [13]http://tavmjong.free.fr/SVG/BUTTON_TEST/button_test.xhtml


     [13] http://tavmjong.free.fr/SVG/BUTTON_TEST/button_test.xhtml


SVG in HTML

   TB: I tried to test 'seamless' attribute
   ... I verified that the SMIL works inside an image
   ... I guess my conclusion from all this is that it is more tricky
   ... than I thought
   ... If you're trying to use more than one button
   ... it becomes more difficult

   ED: Could use window.frameElement

   CM: Could use that to write your script in SVG
   ... One interesting thing you raised was the even propagation
   ... and I don't think it's defined anywhere specifically
   ... I'd be interested to see what happens in another document
   ... with iFrame

   TB: It doesn't
   ... in my page I put a dummy document and tried it
   ... for IE9 it works for both

   CM: That sounds like a general issues that needs to go into DOM
   events
   ... so I guess what might be good that comes out of these tests is
   concrete things that are unresolved
   ... apart from that one you had the marker one

   <ChrisL> tpic: markers and color

Marker and Colour

   CL: currentColor on a given taken element takes the color on a given
   element and uses it
   ... What you're saying is over here I have a marker defined
   ... and over here I have a path defined

   <ChrisL> tav we lost you

   <tbah> i'll be bach in a sec

   TB: Suppose that your marker is defined there is nothing that gives
   you what the colour is

   DS: I think Tav one thing to do is make a proposal for specific
   mechanisms. Why don't you write up some
   ... spec text
   ... and we can reviewed that
   ... I think we all agree that we want the spec to do something
   useful for markers and colours
   ... If you find a away and is unlikely to conflict with current
   implementations then that would be useful

   <scribe> ACTION: Tavmjong to Propose text to address issue with
   marker colours not matching colours of path [recorded in
   [14]http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-minutes.html#action02]

   <trackbot> Created ACTION-2961 - Propose text to address issue with
   marker colours not matching colours of path [on Tavmjong Bah - due
   2011-02-23].

   TB: I liked the idea Patrick suggested in Paris

Review of Progress Events

   <ed>
   [15]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMar/014

   6.html

     [15] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMar/0146.html


   CL: There was a spec that SVG was doing that was about MAE
   ... is this a replacement spec?

   ED: I think we defined progress events in Tiny 1.2 spec
   ... so it's not MAE

   <ed>
   [16]http://www.w3.org/TR/SVGTiny12/svgudom.html#events__ProgressEven

   t

     [16] http://www.w3.org/TR/SVGTiny12/svgudom.html#events__ProgressEvent


   Adrian: Progress events spec is used in a number of different places
   ... it ensures that things a consistent no matter where it is used

   ED: Sent one minor comment about the spec
   ... just wondering if there is a set of those events that could be
   made normative

   DS: Does it say they are not normative?

   ED: Yes

   Adrian: I think it's to do with the naming

   DS: This is a spec that defines a model rather than a set of events

   Adrian: You shouldn't expect to see tests on this spec
   ... because this spec is used by others

   CL: For SVG 2 would we have to import these and change the names?

   Adrian: I think so

   CL: Would you be willing to collect the comments for this spec and
   send them on?

   ED: Ok

   CM: So everyone agrees that next week telcon is cancelled

   trackbot, end telcon

Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: Cameron to Create a Wiki page listing the current
   tests that have less that 2 passes in SVG 1.1 2nd edition [recorded
   in [17]http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-minutes.html#action01]
   [NEW] ACTION: Tavmjong to Propose text to address issue with marker
   colours not matching colours of path [recorded in
   [18]http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-minutes.html#action02]

   [End of minutes]
     _________________________________________________________


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    ([20]CVS log)
    $Date: 2011/02/16 20:39:33 $
     _________________________________________________________

     [19] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm

     [20] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/


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Default Present: Doug_Schepers, anthony_work, [IPcaller], ed, heycam, C
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rianba
Agenda: [22]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMa

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Guessing minutes URL: [23]http://www.w3.org/2011/02/16-svg-minutes.html

People with action items: cameron tavmjong

     [22] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-svg-wg/2011JanMar/0142.html

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