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Re: SVGT 1.2: <use> and <foreignObject>

From: Eric Seidel <eseidel@apple.com>
Date: Mon, 20 Feb 2006 18:39:02 -0800
Message-Id: <8D4B8DCE-D3FF-4529-84C8-B7C38B2E3FF6@apple.com>
Cc: www-svg@w3.org
To: Jon Ferraiolo <jonf@adobe.com>
As Maciej points out, this synchronization is not possible in certain  
cases such as plugin content inside an <html:object> tag in a  
<foreignObject> tag.

Given that, the spec should add a line about the behavior of <use>  
referencing a <foreignObject> tag as being undefined.

The current response is unsatisfactory w/o additional prose to cover  
the <foreignObject> case.


Maciej raised a second (related) issue in his responses about what  
the proper behavior should be for <use> referencing a <video> or  
<audio> element.

Thanks for your time.

-eric

On Feb 19, 2006, at 3:00 PM, Jon Ferraiolo wrote:

> Hi Eric,
>
> This email is the official Last Call response to your comment at:
>
>    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2005Dec/0307.html
>
> which is repeated at the bottom of this email.
>
>
>
> The processing model for svg:use is such that, when multiple  
> svg:use elements reference the same original element, all of the  
> svg:use instances reflect the state of the original object. Here is  
> the quote from the spec (http://www.w3.org/TR/SVGMobile12/ 
> struct.html#UseElement):
>
>
>
> ----------------
>
> The deeply-cloned tree, also refered to as the shadow tree, is then  
> kept in synchronization with the contents of the referenced  
> element, so that any animation or DOM manipulation occurring on the  
> referenced element are also applied to the 'use' element's deeply- 
> cloned tree.
>
> ----------------
>
>
>
> If the referenced element is an svg:foreignObject or contains an  
> svg:foreignObject as a subelement or within an XBL shadow tree, and  
> the svg:foreignObject somehow contains interactive elements (e.g.,  
> an XForms UI control or an HTML forms control), then all svg:use  
> instances will reflect the current interactive state of the  
> referenced element and its descendant elements. For svg:use, it is  
> *not* possible for two svg:use instances of the same referenced  
> elements to have different interactive states (e.g., different text  
> within text fields). Thus, svg:use has restricted flexibility. The  
> long-term vision to provide more flexibility is XBL, where it will  
> be possible to achieve re-usable interactive elements where each  
> instance is allowed to have different interactive state.
>
>
>
> Because there is a possibility in some cases that interactive state  
> might not fall into the category of “DOM manipulation”, we have  
> added a couple of words to the description of the “use” element for  
> more inclusive wording beyond just animation and DOM manipulation.
>
>
>
> Please tell us within two weeks if this response is not satisfactory.
>
>
> Jon Ferraiolo
>
> SVG WG
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
>
>
> From: Eric Seidel <eseidel@apple.com>
>
> Date: Wed, 28 Dec 2005 15:44:38 -0600
>
> Message-Id: <FD4D268B-D2FE-49A5-BA09-0E6F69251386@apple.com>
>
> To: www-svg@w3.org
>
>
>
> == This message seems to have died somewhere in transit, resending. ==
>
>
>
> Greetings,
>
>
>
> I understand that it is not the goal of the SVGT specification to
>
> cover all possible interactions between SVG and other languages.
>
> That said, I would still appreciate a comment from the working group
>
> as to the expected interaction between <use> <foreignObject> and tags
>
> in other languages (like html) such as forms (<input>, <textarea>,
>
> etc.) or plugins (<object>, <embed>, etc.)
>
>
>
> Should for example 2 copies of a plugin be created for a <use> (the
>
> original, non-rendered version in <defs>, as well as the used
>
> instance?)  What happens when a user interacts with one used copy?
>
> Are all other copies expected to update (think of a flash game,
>
> instantiated multiple times on the page via <use> of a
>
> <foreignObject> containing an <embed>)?
>
>
>
> And what about forms? If I type text into one used copy of a form
>
> (<use xlink:href="url(#myForeignObjectWithForms)" />) are all the
>
> others expected to update?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Eric
>
>
>
>
Received on Tuesday, 21 February 2006 02:39:12 UTC

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