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Re: mathcolor/mathbackground on <math/> and <semantics/> elements?

From: Frédéric WANG <fred.wang@free.fr>
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2010 23:00:31 +0200
Message-ID: <4BCF676F.2020300@free.fr>
To: neils@dessci.com
CC: Neil Soiffer <neil.soiffer@gmail.com>, David Carlisle <davidc@nag.co.uk>, "www-math@w3.org" <www-math@w3.org>
OK. FYI, I've recently worked on these attributes and had the same 
interpretation as you: allowed on <math/> but not on <semantics/>. 
However, there are already existing regression tests in Mozilla that 
want these attributes not to have effect on <math/>, so I wanted to 
check that my interpretation was correct.
Thanks for your answers.

PS: Strictly speaking, <semantics/> is not implemented in Firefox yet. 
The only thing we do is using a CSS stylesheet to display the first 
child and hide the other children...

On 21/04/2010 22:19, Neil Soiffer wrote:
> I completely concur with David.
>
> The first version of Firefox's handling of MathML didn't handle 
> semantics, and this was a big problem for a lot of MathML that was 
> generated.  Other implementations also skipped it because <semantics> 
> was listed in chapter 4 -- content MathML.  We have tried to make it 
> much clearer that the semantics elements should be considered part of 
> both presentation and content MathML, and that a renderer that deals 
> with only one side of MathML should handle semantics to at least the 
> extent it makes sense for that side of MathML.
>
> To be a bit perverse, if <semantics> accepted mathcolor/background, 
> then someone could complain that it shouldn't because it is part of 
> content MathML, and the section you quoted doesn't say it should be 
> part of content MathML.
>
>     Neil
>
>
> 2010/4/21 David Carlisle <davidc@nag.co.uk <mailto:davidc@nag.co.uk>>
>
>     On 21/04/2010 11:27, Frédéric WANG wrote:
>
>     Thanks for the comments, the following is a personal reply, we'll get
>     group agreement before actually making any changes.
>
>
>         Hello,
>
>         The spec says that mathcolor/mathbackground are accepted on
>         all MathML
>         presentation elements:
>         http://www.w3.org/TR/MathML3/chapter2.html#interf.toplevel.atts
>
>         <math/> and <semantics/> are not listed among MathML presentation
>         elements, so I think mathcolor/mathbackground should not be
>         allowed on
>         them, and this is confirmed by the RelaxNG schema.
>         http://www.w3.org/TR/MathML3/chapter3.html#presm.summary
>
>         However, the two sentences below could be interpreted as
>         saying that
>         <math/> accepts mathcolor/mathbackground attributes:
>
>         "The math element accepts any of the attributes that can be set on
>         Section 3.3.4 Style Change <mstyle>"
>         "mstyle elements accept the attributes listed in Section 3.1.10
>         Mathematics style attributes common to presentation elements. "
>
>
>     I think this is fairly explicit that math should really work (as
>     far as its children are concerned) like an mstyle. If the schema
>     doesn't have that attribute that's an error, sorry about that.
>
>
>         and this one for <semantics/>:
>
>         "semantics should be considered part of both presentation
>         MathML and
>         content MathML"
>
>
>     That's more of a general hint that for example "just do
>     presentation mathml" systems just  should at least accept
>     semantics to the point of rendering a presentation attribution or
>     a first child if that's presentation. (and not raise an error on
>     semantics as an unknown element) I don't think that this informal
>     note should have any effect on the schema.
>
>     David
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-- 
Frédéric Wang.
www.maths-informatique-jeux.com <http://www.maths-informatique-jeux.com>
www.maths-informatique-jeux.com/international 
<http://www.maths-informatique-jeux.com/international>
Received on Wednesday, 21 April 2010 21:11:01 GMT

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