W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-html@w3.org > February 2001

Re: the time load-rendering order

From: Ignacio Javier <igjav@ctv.es>
Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 01:55:57 +0100
Message-ID: <001701c09a0e$d6ac2740$9b0d243e@florida>
To: "Html Mailing List" <www-html@w3.org>
Cc: <www-style@w3.org>
Hi Murray, maybe I didn't explained completely and/or correctly:

> It would be pointless to render things on the bottom of the page before
> the top part that the user can see,

Talking about audio/video rendering, 2 problems:
1) There are rendering order behaviors that really cannot be achieved used
actual html/css syntax . Using multicolumn graphic tables, for example, try
to render first the center (innermost) cell, with the main part of the logo
of you company, before some of the rest appears. Or havin a page with small
figures mixed in the text, that are prioritary(let's say you think they are
veeery informative) (the Microsoft 0->, for example;) and a deco graphic on
top.
2) A behavior that still being razonably achieved used *(actual html/css
syntax tricks)/(somekindof browser behavior)* is not standard, so no
use/time warranty at all (I cannot remember having read something in html or
css specs about a mandatory load objects order following parse rules, and
not about an specific mandatory rule of what must be first parsed)


> and many (if not all) browsers need
> to render the top items to determine when the lower ones belong.

Specifiying dimensions is something common today in HTML/CSS, at least is
not a "rare webmaster's behavior".

> If you really wanted to do this, you could use JavaScript to load
> them at the top of the page, or your could create a hidden layer
> at the top of the page using ccs, that contained all of the items you
> want to preload, then include the same items lower down in visible layers.

I've never seen a page that warrants any rendering order, mainly because is
different load starting (deterministic?) that load
finishing(deterministic????) and rendering (for example, you can put all in
order of load in html preload tags, and everything absolutely positioned
too, and the problem is that the object that was first in the tag firstly
parsed is the last finishing loading), and this is why preload involves to
wait to load the whole page, and it's not HTML on-the-fly "spirit", and the
user won't wait for a full load, and it involves ecmascript, so it is not
fun.


Believe me, it's very difficult (if not impossible) for the browser to
understand this phrase:

"my dear browser, I wanna you to load my logo first, the graphical menu
second and the rest of media after all, the grahical menu don't worry very
much, because is "text titled", but please show me the logo, because is our
fabulous logo, and the rest of icons embedded in text."

... even if you traduce it to actual ecma/html/css
Received on Sunday, 18 February 2001 19:57:51 GMT

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