Re: Header, Footer, and Sidebars

Andrew n marshall (amarshal@usc.edu)
Sun, 30 Nov 1997 05:41:23 -0800


Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 01:55:44 -0500 (EST)
From: qqbw2 <qqbw2@ix.netcom.com>
To: wopent@aol.com
Message-id: <19943672.886214@relay.comanche.denmark.eu> <Monday@delphi.com>
Subject: part of

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Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 02:17:06 -0500 (EST)
From: rnjj6 <rnjj6@worldnet.att.net>
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Message-Id: <19943672.886214@relay.comanche.denmark.eu> Monday, December 1st, 1997
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                *****CREDIT CARDS ACCEPTED*****
                   MASTERCARD   VISA   AMEX

   PLEASE CALL 213-980-7850 to process your order
                        8am-5pm Pacific Time
                Checks or Money Orders send to:
                      WorldTouch Network Inc.
5670 Wilshire Blvd.  Suite 2170 Los Angeles, CA 90036
Please note:  Allow 5 business days for all checks to
clear before order is shipped.


Message-ID: <01BCFD5B.E64FEC20.amarshal@usc.edu>
From: Andrew n marshall <amarshal@usc.edu>
To: "'Liam Quinn'" <liam@htmlhelp.com>, "www-html@w3.org" <www-html@w3.org>
Cc: "www-style@w3.org" <www-style@w3.org>
Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 05:41:23 -0800
Subject: RE: Header, Footer, and Sidebars

On Friday, November 28, 1997 7:59 PM, Liam Quinn [SMTP:liam@htmlhelp.com] 
wrote:
> What happens if the author does not want styles inherited into an 
included
> HTML document?  If OBJECT allowed styles to inherit, there would be no 
way
> for an author to specify that the styles should not inherit.

Fair enough.  Then I suggest there should be a way to change that in the 
<OBJECT> tag.  Perhaps the next release of HTML should include the a 
property, like the following:
	<OBJECT INHERIT="style">
where the default value is "none", maintaining a backwards compatibility 
with the current standard.  This could also be extended to provide a list 
of inherited properties, such as "target".  Any stylesheets or base targets 
found in the included document override those inherited values.

> For this
> reason, I think we should maintain the distinction between OBJECT and
> server-side includes.  OBJECT embeds completely independent documents
> while server-side includes embed portions of documents that are (mostly)
> dependent on their "parent" for determining the base URL and style.

There are several reasons why we shouldn't be relying on server-side 
includes.  First off, there may not always be a server.  HTML should be 
designed so a site can work from disk, just as well as is could work from a 
web server.  And it should be just as easy to maintain.

Secondly, the major reason authors don't utilize SSI's is because they 
aren't consistent between different servers.  It is a big advantage to know 
your site can be copied between systems as still work perfectly because it 
doesn't rely on the server in that way.

On Friday, November 28, 1997 8:22 PM, gordon [SMTP:gordon@gly.fsu.edu] 
wrote:
> That's not such a bad thing. It's easy enough to include the same style
> sheet, and just as easy for the included document to stand out with its 
own
> style.

The problem here is that style is location dependent.  Therefore a <OBJECT> 
tag within <H1> block would have a very different appearance than an object 
tag within a <P> tag.

On Saturday, November 29, 1997 9:53 AM, Liam Quinn [SMTP:liam@htmlhelp.com] 
wrote:
> But then you have an extra trip to the server, and an extra download for
> the client.

This should only be once for the whole site for an included document, such 
as an navigational aid.  This isn't a

And the biggest reason I would like to see style explicitly inherited is to 
provide a mechanism to inherit the current typeface (and other attributes 
into objects other than just HTML.  The use of CSS is being discussed for 
SMIL on the www-multimedia list.  Inheritance should be an issue. And I 
would really like to inherit the current font into my Java applets when I 
make custom controls as well, so I don't need to explicitly change that too 
and I can assume the font is readable!

Andrew n marshall
  student - artist - programmer
    http://www.media-electronica.com/anm-bin/anm
      "Everyone a mentor,  Everyone a pupil"