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Re: Request to Strengthen the HTML5 Accessibility Design Principle

From: Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch>
Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 11:53:38 +0000 (UTC)
To: Sam Ruby <rubys@intertwingly.net>
Cc: Laura Carlson <laura.lee.carlson@gmail.com>, www-archive <www-archive@w3.org>, Chris Wilson <Chris.Wilson@microsoft.com>, Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>, Anne van Kesteren <annevk@opera.com>, Catherine Roy <ecrire@catherine-roy.net>, Gez Lemon <gez.lemon@gmail.com>, Leif Halvard Silli <lhs@malform.no>, Philip TAYLOR <p.taylor@rhul.ac.uk>, Robert J Burns <rob@robburns.com>, Roger Johansson <roger@456bereastreet.com>, W3C WAI-XTECH <wai-xtech@w3.org>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.62.0906241150370.16244@hixie.dreamhostps.com>
On Wed, 24 Jun 2009, Sam Ruby wrote:
> Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Wed, 24 Jun 2009, Sam Ruby wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I presume, from your e-mail, that you do not consider this to be debate:
> > > > 
> > > >    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html/2009Jun/0173.html
> > > 
> > > |  > *	We need summary for backward compatibility.
> > > |
> > > |  HTML5 supports implementing the summary="" attribute for backwards
> > > |  compatibility as currently written.
> > > 
> > > ... is an example of what Laura describes as "selectively choosing 
> > > those points in a subject which happen to favor a position, while 
> > > ignoring the rest".
> > 
> > What were the points that were ignored here?
> 
> The fact that summary is non-conforming.

Is that relevant to issues of backwards-compatibility? I was under the 
impression that it was not. I wasn't trying to ignore that or selectively 
chose a point here.


> > > Another, more recent, example is "The browser vendors are the 
> > > ultimate gatekeepers, of course".
> > 
> > What points does this ignore? I don't understand.
> 
> The fact that no behavior is being asked of the browser vendors.

If UAs do nothing with summary="", it won't have any effect on 
accessibility. So unless I'm misundertanding something fundamental, this 
is false.


> The fact that I did not comment on the remainder of the post you cited 
> is an indication that I believe that it did further the dialog.

This is encouraging; however, it seems that Laura does not share your 
view, so it would be helpful is Laura could explain why.

Cheers,
-- 
Ian Hickson               U+1047E                )\._.,--....,'``.    fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/       U+263A                /,   _.. \   _\  ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer.   `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
Received on Wednesday, 24 June 2009 11:54:15 GMT

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