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Re: closing a Tab?

From: David Bolter <david.bolter@utoronto.ca>
Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 11:31:15 -0500
Message-ID: <47CC27D3.2090009@utoronto.ca>
To: "Schnabel, Stefan" <stefan.schnabel@sap.com>
CC: Jon Gunderson <jongund@uiuc.edu>, Thomas.Wlodkowski@corp.aol.com, Becky Gibson <Becky_Gibson@notesdev.ibm.com>, wai-xtech@w3.org

An aria-closable seems reasonable. I can't remember past discussions 
about this and why it might not have been included... ?

D
Schnabel, Stefan wrote:
> Agree. So do we need a aria-closable property? Or can we use any of the existing aria properties for that?
>
> Stefan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jon Gunderson [mailto:jongund@uiuc.edu] 
> Sent: Montag, 3. März 2008 15:33
> To: Schnabel, Stefan; Wlodkowski, Thomas; Becky Gibson; wai-xtech@w3.org
> Subject: RE: closing a Tab?
>
> We need to have some awareness of the closability to a tab, like a popup context menu.  I am not sure a tooltip is the best way to do this.
>
> Jon
>
>
> ---- Original message ----
>   
>> Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 09:58:31 +0100
>> From: "Schnabel, Stefan" <stefan.schnabel@sap.com>  
>> Subject: RE: closing a Tab?  
>> To: "Wlodkowski, Thomas" <Thomas.Wlodkowski@corp.aol.com>, "Jon Gunderson" <jongund@uiuc.edu>, "Becky Gibson" <Becky_Gibson@notesdev.ibm.com>, <wai-xtech@w3.org>
>>
>> Tom,
>>
>> That's why we're doing Best Practices, don't we?
>>
>> Think of FireFox. Having 10 Tabs open and arrow keying with additional
>> focusing of the closing cross icon will result in a keyhitcount of 18 to
>> navigate the tabs instead of 9.
>>
>> And don't tell me Firefox isn't a good example :) (just kidding)
>>
>> So currently we solve the issue for Tabs in our Web Dynpro frameworks
>> with memorizing special keys in the tab tooltip in cases where it does
>> make sense.
>>
>> - Stefan 
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Wlodkowski, Thomas [mailto:Thomas.Wlodkowski@corp.aol.com] 
>> Sent: Freitag, 29. Februar 2008 18:25
>> To: Schnabel, Stefan; Jon Gunderson; Becky Gibson; wai-xtech@w3.org
>> Subject: RE: closing a Tab?
>>
>> I also think the icon attached to the tab or in the tab order may also
>> be helpful. We need to consider cognitive load when talking about
>> keyboard shortcuts. Too many web and software apps to track/memorize.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: wai-xtech-request@w3.org [mailto:wai-xtech-request@w3.org] On
>> Behalf Of Schnabel, Stefan
>> Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 11:54 AM
>> To: Jon Gunderson; Becky Gibson; wai-xtech@w3.org
>> Subject: RE: closing a Tab?
>>
>>
>> Jon,
>>
>> better to have a standardized hotkey for closing tab. As a concept we
>> tend to keep tab chains short.
>>
>> Regards
>> Stefan
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: wai-xtech-request@w3.org [mailto:wai-xtech-request@w3.org] On
>> Behalf Of Jon Gunderson
>> Sent: Freitag, 29. Februar 2008 17:32
>> To: Becky Gibson; wai-xtech@w3.org
>> Subject: Re: closing a Tab?
>>
>>
>> Why can't the close icon be in tab order and the icon can also be part
>> of the label for the tab.
>>
>> Jon
>>
>>
>> ---- Original message ----
>>     
>>> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2008 15:35:21 -0500
>>> From: "Becky Gibson" <Becky_Gibson@notesdev.ibm.com>  
>>> Subject: Re: closing a Tab?  
>>> To: wai-xtech@w3.org
>>>
>>>
>>> I implemented a context menu for closable tabs in the dojo tab
>>>       
>> container. 
>>     
>>> See the second tab panel example on [1]. The tabs with title "first"
>>>       
>> and 
>>     
>>> "third" are closable. Pressing shift-F10 with focus on these tabs will 
>>> bring up a context menu with "close".  If a tab is closable, pressing
>>>       
>> the 
>>     
>>> delete key with focus on the title will delete the tab.  I thought this
>>>       
>> is 
>>     
>>> what the style guide group had decided upon?  Although it would be nice
>>>       
>> if 
>>     
>>> there was a way to indicate to the screen reader user that a tab (or
>>>       
>> any 
>>     
>>> other item) was deletable without having the use the shift-F10
>>>       
>> discovery 
>>     
>>> mechanism. 
>>>
>>> I based my implementation decision on the  DHTML Style Guide June 29,
>>>       
>> 2007 
>>     
>>> meeting minutes [2]: 
>>> TW: options other than DELETE - CTRL+F4 a possibility, have
>>> to get comments on that - what we are saying is context menu and
>>>       
>> keyboard 
>>     
>>> shortcut combo fine - great if had property so didn't have to use
>>>       
>> context 
>>     
>>> menu, but maybe that's phase 2
>>> So perhaps we made a decision but just didn't record it in the style 
>>> guide?
>>> [1] 
>>> http://archive.dojotoolkit.org/nightly/dojotoolkit/dijit/tests/layout/t
>>>       
>> est_TabContainer.html
>>     
>>> [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/wai-xtech/2007Jun/0130.html
>>>
>>> Becky Gibson
>>> Web Accessibility Architect
>>>                                                       
>>> IBM Emerging Internet Technologies
>>> 5 Technology Park Drive
>>> Westford, MA 01886
>>> Voice: 978 399-6101; t/l 333-6101
>>> Email: gibsonb@us.ibm.com
>>> blog: WebA11y
>>>
>>>
>>> wai-xtech-request@w3.org wrote on 02/28/2008 03:06:06 PM:
>>>
>>>       
>>>> In the Best Practices we have a dangling question:
>>>>
>>>> <quote
>>>> cite="http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-practices/#TabPanel">
>>>>
>>>> Unresolved at time of port from DHTML wiki: How to indicate that a 
>>>> tab panel can be deleted? Visually a close icon can be provided in 
>>>> the upper right hand corner of the tab which the user can click on to
>>>>         
>>>> delete the tab panel. Putting this close icon in the navigation 
>>>> sequence would make extra navigation. Is there some way to indicate 
>>>> to a non-visual user that a tab panel can be deleted with a defined 
>>>> keystroke? Perhaps we can capture ctrl-w (the key used in Firefox and
>>>>         
>>>> IE 7) to close a tab? T * here is still the issue of the user knowing
>>>>         
>>>> that the tab is closable or not. Another option is to provide a 
>>>> context menu. With focus on the tab title the user would press shift-
>>>>         
>>>> F10 to invoke a context menu - the context menu would have the close 
>>>> option. In both of these cases if the tab can not be closed, it still
>>>>         
>>>> needs to capture the keystroke so that it doesn't get bubbled up and 
>>>> handled by the browser. Retrieved from "http://www.weba11y.com/ 
>>>> styleguide/index.php?title=Tab_Panel"
>>>>
>>>> </quote>
>>>>
>>>> Don,
>>>>
>>>> Could you get this on the agenda for the Style
>>>> Guide Group to suggest a preferred user experience?
>>>>
>>>> Al
>>>>
>>>> /satisfying ACTION-101
>>>>
>>>> PS:  I didn't immediately find an answer at
>>>> http://dev.aol.com/dhtml_style_guide#tabpanel
>>>>
>>>>         
>>>
>>>       
>> Jon Gunderson, Ph.D.
>> Coordinator Information Technology Accessibility
>> Disability Resources and Educational Services
>>
>> Rehabilitation Education Center
>> Room 86
>> 1207 S. Oak Street
>> Champaign, Illinois 61821
>>
>> Voice: (217) 244-5870
>>
>> WWW: http://www.cita.uiuc.edu/
>> WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>     
> Jon Gunderson, Ph.D.
> Coordinator Information Technology Accessibility
> Disability Resources and Educational Services
>
> Rehabilitation Education Center
> Room 86
> 1207 S. Oak Street
> Champaign, Illinois 61821
>
> Voice: (217) 244-5870
>
> WWW: http://www.cita.uiuc.edu/
> WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/
>
>
>
>   
Received on Monday, 3 March 2008 16:31:31 UTC

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