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minutes: UAWG telecon 18 Oct 2012

From: Jim Allan <jimallan@tsbvi.edu>
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2012 13:40:14 -0500
Message-ID: <CA+=z1WmvifpQkkXLRCRH1w5JEhr1eX3Gdpp3TYHirQS0veJkbA@mail.gmail.com>
To: WAI-ua <w3c-wai-ua@w3.org>
from http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html
User Agent Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
18 Oct 2012

See also: IRC log http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-irc
Attendees

Present
    Greg_Lowney, Jeanne, Jim_Allan, Kim_Patch, kford, Jan, sharper
Regrets
    Mark-partial-in-late
Chair
    jimallan, kellyford
Scribe
    jallan, kford

Contents

    Topics
        Action-743 Sequential Navigation
        Action-762 check wording on 2.2.3
        Action-765 direct command notification
        Review Mobile example writing
        Action-759 https://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/tracker/actions/759 Simon?
        Levels Discussion
        Review Mobile example writing
    Summary of Action Items

Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: jeanne to edit 1.2.1 based on suggestion from minutes of
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/12-ua-minutes [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action06]
[NEW] ACTION: jeanne to update doc to include Jan's 743 proposal from
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0011.html
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: jeanne to update doc with changes from Jim's email
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0015.html on
2.2.3 [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: jeanne to update document with the text above in 2.3.2
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action04]
[NEW] ACTION: jeanne to update glossary with text above (see email)
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action05]
[NEW] ACTION: jeanne to update the doc with Jan's recommendation from
2.3.x with Greg's edits. See above [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Date: 18 October 2012

<JAllan> open item 1

<JAllan> kp: went through 1,2 and 3 wrote mobile examples for those
that needed it

<JAllan> scribe: jallan

mobile resources:
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0012.html
http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2012/ED-IMPLEMENTING-UAAG20-20121012/

js: kwalbin liked UAAG

close item 4

action 743 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0011.html

<trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find 743. You can review and register
nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/tracker/users>.
Action-743 Sequential Navigation

<kford> scribe: kford

JAN: I had an older action here. These terms around serial access and
such were used in different places. I tried to consolidate.

JAN goes over his proposal.

Kim: It seems like when you are using a rotor you can skip the actual thing.

<JAllan> gl comments:
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0018.html

GL: It is useful to distinguish the navigation technique from the
things that are being navigated.
... You can do sequential navigation over something.
... Hierarchical navigation might offer more such as next/previous at
same level, or back and down the tree.

JA: Any objections to Jan's proposal?

<jeanne> ACTION: jeanne to update doc to include Jan's 743 proposal
from http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0011.html
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-770 - Update doc to include Jan's 743
proposal from http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0011.html
[on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2012-10-25].

We welcome back Simon.

<JAllan> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0015.html
Action-762 check wording on 2.2.3

JA: I wanted to expand because we had confusion on what we meant by
document order.

JA goes over his proposal.

<JAllan> <new> 2.2.3 Default Navigation Order (former 1.9.9): If the author has

<JAllan> not specified a navigation order, the default *sequential navigation*

<JAllan> order is the document source code order. (Level A)
Action-765 direct command notification

<JAllan> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0010.html

<jeanne> ACTION: jeanne to update doc with changes from Jim's email
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0015.html on
2.2.3 [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-771 - Update doc with changes from Jim's
email http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0015.html
on 2.2.3 [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2012-10-25].

<JAllan> 2.3.x Present Direct Commands from Rendered Content: The user
can receive a presentation of any *recognized* *direct commands* from
the *rendered content*. (Level A)

Jan reads his proposal.

<JAllan> new implementing draft with the mobile examples:
http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2012/ED-IMPLEMENTING-UAAG20-20121012/

Group exploring how they want to handle these proposals.

JA: Any objections to 2.3.x?

KP: No.

GL: Just small editorial.

<JAllan> 2.3.x Present Direct Commands from Rendered Content: The user
can receive a presentation of any *recognized* *direct commands* in
the *rendered content*. (Level A)

Group talking about GL's concern.

<jeanne> ACTION: jeanne to update the doc with Jan's recommendation
from 2.3.x with Greg's edits. See above [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-772 - Update the doc with Jan's
recommendation from 2.3.x with Greg's edits. See above [on Jeanne F
Spellman - due 2012-10-25].

<JAllan> proposed edit: 2.3.2 Present Direct Commands from Rendered
Content (Enhanced): The user can receive a presentation of any
*recognized* *direct commands* from the *rendered content* with their
associated elements (e.g., as an overlay). (Level AA)

Now looking at 2.3.2

<JAllan> 2.3.2 Present Direct Commands in Rendered Content (Enhanced):
The user can receive a presentation of any *recognized* *direct
commands* in the *rendered content* with their associated elements
(e.g., as an overlay). (Level AA)

No objections to 2.3.2

<jeanne> ACTION: jeanne to update document with the text above in
2.3.2 [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-773 - Update document with the text above in
2.3.2 [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2012-10-25].

Last is glossary.

<JAllan> new glossary

JAN explains his last proposal.

<JAllan> GLOSSARY:

<JAllan> command, direct command, direct navigation command, direct
activation command, linear navigation command , spatial (directional)
command, structural navigation command

<JAllan> - direct commands apply to a specified item (e.g., button) or
action (e.g. save function), regardless of the current focus location

<JAllan> + direct navigation commands move focus to the specified item

<JAllan> + direct activation commands activate the specified item (and
may also move focus to it) or action

<JAllan> - linear navigation commands (sometimes called logical or
sequential navigation commands) move focus forwards and backwards
through a list of items

<JAllan> - structural navigation commands move focus forwards,
backwards, up and down a hierarchy of items

<JAllan> - spatial commands (sometimes called directional commands),
require the user to be cognizant of the spatial arrangement of items
on the screen:

<JAllan> + spatial navigation commands move focus from one item to
another based on direction on the screen

<JAllan> + spatial manipulation commands resize or reposition an item
on the screen

<JAllan> plus is sub-bullet under the -

<JAllan> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012OctDec/0010.html

JA: Any objections to this last?

KP: No, looks good.

JA: I don't hear any objections.
... Let's take this then.

<jeanne> ACTION: jeanne to update glossary with text above (see email)
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-774 - Update glossary with text above (see
email) [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2012-10-25].

<JAllan> close action-743

<trackbot> ACTION-743 Look at cleaning up glossary terms "serial
access, sequential navigation" and linear navigation commands closed

<JAllan> close action-762

<trackbot> ACTION-762 Review 2.2.3 for language, do we mean tab,
source, or document order? closed

<JAllan> close action-765

<trackbot> ACTION-765 Propose a new 2.3.X that is the list version of
direct commands notification closed
Review Mobile example writing
Action-759 https://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/tracker/actions/759 Simon?

<sharper> http://www.w3.org/WAI/RD/wiki/Static_Documents_on_the_Web:_Document_Accessibility

SH: I've added this request to our wiki of existing requests.

<JAllan> close action-759

<trackbot> ACTION-759 Forward a request to RDWG that they suggest that
students looking for projects build an extention that allows people to
put navigation marks in a page - 1.8.12 closed
Levels Discussion
Review Mobile example writing

<JAllan> http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2012/ED-IMPLEMENTING-UAAG20-20121012/

JA: Jeanne has added a group of mobile examples from an activity that
was done last Friday.

KP: 1.2.1 intent wasn't clear to the group creating these examples.
... The second paragraph seemed confusing, like it didn't belong.

<jeanne> ACTION: jeanne to edit 1.2.1 based on suggestion from minutes
of http://www.w3.org/2012/10/12-ua-minutes [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/10/18-ua-minutes.html#action06]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-775 - Edit 1.2.1 based on suggestion from
minutes of http://www.w3.org/2012/10/12-ua-minutes [on Jeanne F
Spellman - due 2012-10-25].

<Jan> 1.1.2 pixelated?

Group is reviewing mobile examples.

<Greg> In the Brin example of 1.1.1, might explain why the mobile
example is different, as in: On her mobile phone the developers did
not want to take up space with a button, so Brin touches a video to
display the controls including the "display caption" control.

<JAllan> the mobile screen isn't big enough for effective zooming of
images, he prefers the text version of the images

<Greg> Otherwise it's not clear why the mobile example is different
than the primary (presumably desktop, although it does not say that)
example.

<JAllan> 1.1.3 ben example seems more about the control than alternative content

<Jan> In the Ben 1.1.3 example, the floating control on the mobile
phone...is it trying to say the whole mobile UI can be treated as a
UA? If not better to clarify that the floating control is for a media
player app.

<JAllan> perhaps better in 1.1.5 size of media alternatives...changing
size of captions?

<sharper> 1.7.3 'Mattias has ADHD' should we elaborate ADHD to
Attention deficit hyperactivity disorder

<JAllan> 1.4.1 ben..."he chooses large text (remove the 'to' before large)

<Jan> In 1.4.1..."chooses to USE large"...also I think we should just
say the mobile browser has this setting, nnot the mobile OS as a whole

<JAllan> +1 to simon above

<Jan> 1.7.4 Tanya browses to a new website on her mobile BROWSER.

<Greg> Re George in 1.3.1, again perhaps clarify why this is unique to
mobile, as in "The user interface was designed for touchscreen so by
default it doesn't show a focus indicator, but George turns on the
focus indicator so that he knows..."

<JAllan> +1 to greg

<Greg> Re Ben in 1.4.1, it's not clear to me how this example differs
from those already present, one of which is explicitly about mobile
phones and one of which is abut choosing large font size.

<JAllan> 1.8.2 lee...new sentence. A visible scrollbar appears
indicating that content has been moved on to the screen, but there is
more available off screen

<Jan> in general, I see a lot of "mobile device" and "mobile
phone"....should be "mobile browser" for clarity

<sharper> I agree with Jan's mobile browser comment

<Greg> Re Tanya in 1.7.4, there's nothing linking this to accessibility.

<JAllan> 1.8.5 this is already a feature of maps (zooming in and out).
this doesn't say enough about the accessibility.

<Jan> 1.8.10 Ray is blind. USING His mobile device HE CAN OPEN
location links and calendar dates found on web pages in native apps ON
HIS device.

<Jan> jeanne....then maybe instead of this kind of structure "$$ When
Frank is using his mobile phone to read a web page,"...say it like
this: "$$ When Frank is reading a web page on his mobile"

<Greg> Re Lee in 1.8.2, it could be rewritten to clarify that this is
true on all platforms, but especially important on her mobile device
because the small screen requires scrolling more frequently. E.g. "Lee
typically views web content at a high level of zoom, frequently
positioning elements outside the viewport. When moving between
focusable elements, the viewport automatically scrolls to the...

<Greg> ...element currently in focus. This is particularly important
on her mobile device, as the smaller screen makes scrolling more
frequent."

<JAllan> 1.8.13 bookmarks (internal markers set by the user).

<JAllan> +1 to greg...adding a bit of explanation to educate the developer

<Greg> Re Terry in 1.8.4, might tie it to the browser by adding "Her
web browser respects that setting."

<JAllan> done with GL1

<Greg> Agree with Jim about 1.8.5. Perhaps mention that having a
thumbnail map that shows which portion of the larger view is visible
in the zoomed-in portion is very helpful to her, but I'm not clear
that's a good real-world example, as having two maps is itself
confusing to many people.

<sharper> http://www.hyper-anchor.org/en/

<JAllan> above related to 1.8.13

<JAllan> add as a resource to 1.8.13 http://www.hyper-anchor.org/en/

<JAllan> kp: can we bump to AA instead of AAA, as we have a cross
browser implementation.

<Jan> In 2.1.4 replace the new example (which I don't think makes
sense) with: $$ Ari uses a scanning onscreen keyboard to navigate
sequentially past operable elements until he reaches the element he
intends to activate.

<Greg> Re 1.8.6 change "zoom feature increases the size of both text
and images" to say "zoom feature changes the size of both text and
images", as she's using it to zoom out as well as in.

<JAllan> js: +1

<JAllan> +1

<sharper> +1

<JAllan> +1 related to kp moving 1.8.13 to AA

<JAllan> kp: proposes moving 1.8.13 to AA because of
http://www.hyper-anchor.org/en/ and it works in ie, ff, and chrome,
(mac?)

<JAllan> jim, js, kp, sh, all agree

<Jan> I note this "The bookmark added by HYPER-ANCHOR can be used in a
web browser without HYPER-ANCHOR installed, however the page does not
scroll automatically and the highlight styles are not applied."

<Greg> Re Frank in 1.8.12, not clear how this differs from the usual
scenario, maybe to "always display zoomed content to fit in one
column" add "that fits in the width of his screen, so that he does not
need to scroll horizontally."

<JAllan> sh: hyper-anchor - this is just a url that jumps to the dom

<JAllan> js: please send any other comments about mobile example to the list.

<JAllan> kp: also, if you have any ideas for GL 4 & 5 send those too

<JAllan> js: need suggestions for folks who could address mobile
examples in gl 4 & 5


[End of minutes]

-- 
Jim Allan, Accessibility Coordinator & Webmaster
Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired
1100 W. 45th St., Austin, Texas 78756
voice 512.206.9315    fax: 512.206.9264  http://www.tsbvi.edu/
"We shape our tools and thereafter our tools shape us." McLuhan, 1964
Received on Thursday, 18 October 2012 18:40:40 GMT

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