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Re: DHTML show/hide sections & screen readers

From: david poehlman <david.poehlman@handsontechnologeyes.com>
Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 10:24:06 -0400
Message-ID: <004401c55635$1829dfa0$6501a8c0@DAVIDPC>
To: "Jon Gunderson" <jongund@uiuc.edu>, <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>

I did notfeel this uncertainty.  I'm not saying that we should not do the 
right thing here for I imagine that safari with oiceover will handle this 
quite differently, and I know we have a wide range of options to consider. 
Anyone using jaws 6.1 having the experience I relate though will react the 
same way.  When you explore the result of activating the link, it becomes 
immediately apparent that there is new content.  We are used to having 
content change without any apparent movement.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jon Gunderson" <jongund@uiuc.edu>
To: <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: DHTML show/hide sections & screen readers



But still there is uncertainty why you did not go to a new
page and you appear to be at the same spot you started.  Many
users might think nothing happened and go somewhere else.

Jon

---- Original message ----
>Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 09:58:11 -0400
>From: "david poehlman"
<david.poehlman@handsontechnologeyes.com>
>Subject: Re: DHTML show/hide sections & screen readers
>To: "Jon Gunderson" <jongund@uiuc.edu>, "Stuart Smith"
<Stuart.M.Smith@manchester.ac.uk>, <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
>
>
>I just figure that since jaws is telling me it's a link that
I'm getting
>something new and jaws does read out the page.
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: "Jon Gunderson" <jongund@uiuc.edu>
>To: "Stuart Smith" <Stuart.M.Smith@manchester.ac.uk>;
<w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
>Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 9:54 AM
>Subject: RE: DHTML show/hide sections & screen readers
>
>
>
>There are other speech output technologies like GW-Micro
>WIndows Eyes and IBM Home Page reader.
>
>In general JAWS and IBM Home Page Reader will not read content
>that has the CSS display property set to none.  If you switch
>it to display: block | inline it will then read the content.
>
>I think the biggest problem here is how does someone know that
>this link shows more content when you select.  This is a
>problem for everyone, but probably bigger for people using
>screen readers since when the link is selected they cannot
>"see" the new content appearing on the screen.
>
>Jon
>
>
>
>
>
>---- Original message ----
>>Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 12:37:38 +0100
>>From: "Stuart Smith" <Stuart.M.Smith@manchester.ac.uk>
>>Subject: RE: DHTML show/hide sections & screen readers
>>To: <w3c-wai-ig@w3.org>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: w3c-wai-ig-request@w3.org
>[mailto:w3c-wai-ig-request@w3.org] On Behalf
>>Of Rebecca Cox
>>Sent: 11 May 2005 07:03
>>To: w3c-wai-ig@w3.org
>>Subject: DHTML show/hide sections & screen readers
>>
>>
>>
>>Hi all
>>
>>I'm working on some pages where there is javascript run
>onpage load to
>>hide some divs (by adding CSS display: none), which are then
>shown when
>>the user clicks on a link (CSS changes to display: block).
>Its all in a
>>window.onload, no script or CSS in the HTML.
>>
>>I am wondering how screen readers do with this - eg if my use
>of onclick
>>is going to cause any issues here. And in general, how do
>people using
>>screen readers eg Jaws, find this sort of DHTML? If anyone
>knows of any
>>articles etc on this I would be very interested.
>>
>>My test page is up at
>http://users.actrix.co.nz/rebecca.cox/dhtml/
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Rebecca
>>
>>Hi Rebecca
>>
>>In a nutshell it might cause a problem with screen readers,
>especially older
>>ones. Also there are other accessibility issues to consider
>with JavaScript
>>such as it's reliance on the mouse.
>>
>>That said, I am definitely not saying you shouldn't use. You
>might want to
>>research the <noscript> tag which hides scripts from browsers
>not using it.
>>You can then embed an alternative.
>>
>>The place is as good as many others for more information
>>
>>http://ltg-projects.ummu.umich.edu/~melledge/accessibilitysite/Noscript.html
>>
>>If you try the code below just after the <script> tag and
>switch off
>>JavaScript in your browser you will get some idea of how it
works
>>
>>Cheers
>>
>>Stu
>>
>><noscript>
>><body>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>><h1>Show hide script test page</h1>
>>
>><p>Test page for a script which sets content blocks to
>display:none on page
>>load, then sets them to display:block onclick.</p>
>>
>><h2>Heading for section 1</h2>
>>
>>
>><p>Content for section 1.</p>
>>
>><dl>
>><dt>Heading for sub section 1a</dt>
>><dd id="subsection0">
>>Content for sub section 1a.
>>
>></dd>
>>
>>
>><dt>Heading for sub section 1b</dt>
>><dd>
>>Content for sub section 1b.
>></dd>
>></dl>
>>
>></div>
>>
>><h2>Heading for section 2</h2>
>>
>><div>
>><p>Content for section 2.</p>
>>
>>
>></div>
>></div>
>>
>></body>
>></noscript>
>>
>>
>
>
>Jon Gunderson, Ph.D., ATP
>Director of IT Accessibility Services
>Campus Information Technologies and Educational Services (CITES)
>and
>Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology
>Disability Resources and Education Services (DRES)
>
>Voice: (217) 244-5870
>Fax: (217) 333-0248
>
>E-mail: jongund@uiuc.edu
>
>WWW: http://cita.rehab.uiuc.edu/
>WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/
>
>
>
>
>


Jon Gunderson, Ph.D., ATP
Director of IT Accessibility Services
Campus Information Technologies and Educational Services (CITES)
and
Coordinator of Assistive Communication and Information Technology
Disability Resources and Education Services (DRES)

Voice: (217) 244-5870
Fax: (217) 333-0248

E-mail: jongund@uiuc.edu

WWW: http://cita.rehab.uiuc.edu/
WWW: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jongund/www/
Received on Wednesday, 11 May 2005 14:24:11 GMT

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