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RE: question: fixed vs. liquid layout

From: Gregg Vanderheiden <gv@trace.wisc.edu>
Date: Wed, 16 Jun 2004 15:43:27 -0500
To: "'Joe Clark'" <joeclark@joeclark.org>, "'WAI-GL'" <w3c-wai-gl@w3.org>
Message-ID: <auto-000070596691@spamarrest.com>


Please do not equate a comment on a single post to the opinion of the full

This is a list for open discussion and many ideas are posted by many people
just to try them out.  It is good to comment on the post or idea.  Please do
not attribute any opinions expressed though as being those of the working
group unless they are posted specifically saying that consensus was reached
on the point.


And thanks for your comments on this.

 -- ------------------------------ 
Gregg C Vanderheiden Ph.D. 
Professor - Ind. Engr. & BioMed Engr.
Director - Trace R & D Center 
University of Wisconsin-Madison 

-----Original Message-----
From: w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org [mailto:w3c-wai-gl-request@w3.org] On Behalf
Of Joe Clark
Sent: Wednesday, June 16, 2004 2:14 PM
Subject: RE: question: fixed vs. liquid layout

> In my mind there is no question, flexible and fluid,
> give control to the user, not end content with fixed presentation.

The user *always* has control via user CSS-- though that is extremely 
difficult to apply with randomly-named divs.

> that is, to me a guiding light of accessibility

It is, however, an uninformed and utopian declaration that ignores *quite 
a lot* of discussion about fixed, liquid, and Jell-O layouts that has 
already gone on among standards-compliant developers.

So no, in fact not all fixed layouts are bad and not all liquid ones are
good. I promise you I can break every single one of them within minutes.  
Nor are layouts with some fixed and some liquid components necessarily
good or bad.

In any event, this esteemed Working Group simply doesn't have enough
knowledge of graphic design, information architecture, or psychology of
reading to issue any kind of credible detailed opinion on layouts. 
There is, moreover, the years-long anti-design bias, where any site 
that looks nice is automatically assumed inaccessible (fixed layouts 
being a useful scapegoat there). And do keep in mind that some of you 
still think pixels are a fixed unit.

The standardistas are way ahead of you on this and what they're doing
should be researched.


    Joe Clark | joeclark@joeclark.org
    Accessibility <http://joeclark.org/access/>
    Expect criticism if you top-post
Received on Wednesday, 16 June 2004 16:43:34 UTC

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