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Minutes from 15 June 2000

From: Wendy A Chisholm <wendy@w3.org>
Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 17:38:22 -0400
Message-Id: <4.2.0.58.20000615173743.025dcc10@localhost>
To: w3c-wai-gl@w3.org
HTML available at: http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/meetings/20000615.html

15 June 2000
Summary of action items and resolutions
Action GR: Take Ian's proposal for accessible lists with CSS to the ER list.
Action WC: Add Ian's proposals for list with CSS to the CSS module.
Action WL: Ask Daniel about tablin and bidirectional tables.
Action WL: Ask Chris and Hakon about CSS generated text.
Action WC: Add proposal to Open issues: CSS generated text is likely to be 
misused and we should add a cautionary note to the CSS Techniques module.
Resolution: Leave the User Agent Support Page as is for now. If people find 
relevant resources, post to list for inclusion in references.
Resolution: to provide author with information and let them decide to use 
"" or " " for decorational images.
Action DB: Ask UA if user agents generate a 0,0 to the server if an area on 
a server-side image map is not selected. We would like to know if redundant 
text links could be returned if a server receives 0,0 but are not sure if 
all browsers generate it.
Resolution: Based on UA's response, add to Techniques or not.
Resolution: Clarify in HTML Techniques that the principles of ABBR apply no 
matter where they are, in a table heading or not.
Action CS: resurrect the dynamic content thread on the list.
Action/Resolution: WC Needs to fix lots of things with Techniques docs. 
Won't have a chance to rereleased until next week (traveling today through 
thursday). will look at permission issue. If people could get action items 
done before next Thursday, once I'm back I can incorporate those in and 
publish a new draft next Friday.
Action KHS Draft a combination of the Generalized checkpoints and the 
technology-specific checkpoints.
Participants
William Loughborogh
Tim Noonan
Dick Brown
Jason White
Katie Hareitbos-Shea
Wendy Chisholm
Gregory Rosmaita
Cynthia Shelley
Regrets
Charles McCathieNevile
Gregg Vanderheiden
Agenda
Which, if any, of the issues on the list can now properly be regarded as 
closed?
Are there additional issues, not included on the list, surrounding the 
working group's deliverables, which should be added?
With respect to the techniques document modules: Further work is needed to 
document techniques appropriate to certain specific formats and interfaces, 
for example SMIL and the DOM.
How should these tasks be assigned within the working group? If you are 
willing to accept action items related to any of these technologies, please 
volunteer (details will be discussed at the meeting)?
We need to prepare the Techniques for distribution as a public working 
draft. Which aspects of the required work would it be most important to 
complete prior to publication?
Integration of guidelines and technology-specific checklists, together with 
other administrative considerations and working group activities, will also 
be discussed.
Proposal for accessible list example
Action GR: Take Ian's proposal for accessible lists with CSS to the ER list.
Action WC: Add Ian's proposals for list with CSS to the CSS module.
Bidirectional tables
Action WL: Ask Daniel about tablin and bidirectional tables.
CSS generated text
Action WL: Ask Chris and Hakon about CSS generated text.
JW think a UA issue.
WL But content in CSS is tying content to presentation.
JW It is addressed by P3 item in UA. Don't think it would be appropriate to 
add further markup to repair.
WC what about WL's point?
JW Doesn't fall into that category. It is not important information, but 
things that are style dependent.
WL H1 and H2 were supposed to be structure, ended up presentation. People 
will write whole blocks in CSS.
JW This is likely to be misused and we should have a cautionary note?
Action WC: Add proposal to Open issues: CSS generated text is likely to be 
misused and we should add a cautionary note to the CSS Techniques module.
User agent support page
WC Has not changed in a while. Addressed in Requirements document. What 
should we do?
WL Leave as is.
JW Too bad external resources are not kept up to date.
Resolution: Leave the User Agent Support Page as is for now. If people find 
relevant resources, post to list for inclusion in references.
Spacer images examples
WC propose author decision, educate the author and let them decide to use 
"" or " ".
Resolution: to provide author with information and let them decide to use 
"" or " " for decorational images.
Alternative pages with telephone
Resolution: providing a phone number, fax number, e-mail address, or postal 
address where info is available, preferably 24 hours a day does not count 
as an alternative accessible page.
Technique for server-side maps
WC almost a user agent issue?
JW Where does this help us? Some servers use 0,0 as an indication to 
provide an alternative to an image map.
KHS Not asking for redundant links.
JW One way to reformat: can the redundant link be behind the server-side 
image map?
WC it's server-side authoring, but authoring nontheless.
JW Should it be a techniques mentioned in the Techniques doc? Some UAs 
might not be able to do that.
GR If support for OBJECT, then could provide redundant text links in the 
content.
Action DB: Ask UA if user agents generate a 0,0 to the server if an area on 
a server-side image map is not selected. We would like to know if redundant 
text links could be returned if a server receives 0,0 but are not sure if 
all browsers generate it.
Resolution: Based on UA's response, add to Techniques or not.
Abbreviations for table headers
JW The use of ABBR is author discretion. Would be the same in table header 
as anywhere else. Apply the principles of ABBR no matter where they are, in 
a table heading or not.
GR due from a miscommunication in ER WG last summer. If long prompted for 
attribute, if abbreviation prompted for element.
Resolution: Clarify in HTML Techniques that the principles of ABBR apply no 
matter where they are, in a table heading or not.
Raising additional issues
WL should be on the list to be fair with the rest of the list.
Action CS: resurrect the dynamic content thread on the list.
TN When I tried to access Techniques doc yesterday it said that I didn't 
have permission.
Action/Resolution: WC Needs to fix lots of things with Techniques docs. 
Won't have a chance to rereleased until next week (traveling today through 
thursday). will look at permission issue. If people could get action items 
done before next Thursday, once I'm back I can incorporate those in and 
publish a new draft next Friday.
Further techniques modules
JW need work on SVG, MathML, Non-W3C technologies (with restrictions on 
what we can say about it), RDF, XML, SMIL, etc. We're trying to address 
what we can say and how to say it. We need good modules for the standards.
TN comfortable writing, but don't have the knowledge of the technologies.
WC Info exists for SMIL, SVG, and XML that needs to be repurposed. Where 
don't have technological knowledge, should go to the working group, like 
XSL. Where we do have knowledge (like access note) we should repurpose those.
JW don't need a module on XSL, but in relation to XHTML, for example.
WC WML is another interesting one. I have read their guidelines and didn't 
see too many issues (fixable) but the UA is tied to the device. What are 
the accessibility issues?
JW so, we have CMN, WC, and IJ working on modules as they have time. Not 
concerned about XML since will be incorporated as we revise. WC - which 
modules do you not have info for?
WC MathML.
JW hmmm. T.V. Raman...who would have time to write? Who has the knowledge? 
Possibly go to the working group. Do we need usage guidelines?
Resolution: MathML module on backburner - get through SVG, SMIL, etc. but 
when ready to work on MathML, go to working group to find someone to help 
answer quesitons.
WL RDF
JW relates to SVG and other areas. CMN working with.
WC same boat as DOM, CSS, XSL, etc. techniques are tied to which language 
using it with.
JW DOM is language independent.
Next meeting
JW Should be next week. Not sure if we have enough for an agenda. If we get 
enough work done on action items, we could discuss those.
Action KHS Draft a combination of the Generalized checkpoints and the 
technology-specific checkpoints.
Members in good standing
JW We will begin keeping track of members in good standing. More info is 
forthcoming on the mailing list.
Digital signatures
WL about to be passed into law in the next 2 days. No one in disability 
community had any input until recently. Cynthia realized they were pretty 
clueless. Web will be part of Web process things.
JW At least they will be recognized as legitimate signature.
WL that's my rant for the call.

$Date: 2000/06/15 21:34:50 $ Wendy Chisholm
--
wendy a chisholm
world wide web consortium
web accessibility initiative
madison, wi usa
tel: +1 608 663 6346
/--
Received on Thursday, 15 June 2000 17:38:05 GMT

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