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Re: SSN-XG Meeting Minutes 15-July-2009

From: John Graybeal <graybeal@mbari.org>
Date: Thu, 16 Jul 2009 07:54:30 -0700
Cc: "'Krzysztof Janowicz'" <janowicz@uni-muenster.de>, <public-xg-ssn@w3.org>, "'Raúl García Castro'" <rgarcia@fi.upm.es>
Message-Id: <45F51992-6B4C-48E8-BEF3-F830782806EC@mbari.org>
To: Oscar Corcho <ocorcho@fi.upm.es>
I concur with doing project management at SourceForge, and that it is  
not a suitable way to maintain the ontology versions themselves.  An  
ontology repository should be selected for maintaining versions of the  

Following is a use case we consider important for MMI's ontology  
repository [1]; I would be especially pleased to use any combination  
that supports it.

1) The first version of the ontology is submitted to the server. A  
service automatically provides dereferencing for the URIs for all the  
concepts in the ontology.
2) A second version is submitted to the server.  New URIs are created  
for all the concepts that have changed. (Philosophically, I'd like new  
URIs for all the concepts, but I appreciate that some have visceral  
issues with that approach.)
3) Any concept that is changed is automatically pointed back (in RDF)  
to its predecessor using an invertible relationship.

With this use case accomplished, versions are automatically tracked.   
Equally important, someone who uses a concept (URI) at a particular  
stage of the ontology's development has a method to (a) guarantee the  
concept doesn't change from under them, and (b) follow the trail to  
any subsequent versions of that concept, should they need to do so.

The MMI repository has this capability, but does not have concept- 
level differencing capabilities (yet), and does not support wiki-like  
editing of terms, the way WebProtege (for example) is intended to. But  
it is offered to this project for its other features, should those be  


[1] MMI Ontology Registry and Repository: http://mmisw.org/or

On Jul 16, 2009, at 12:33 AM, Oscar Corcho wrote:

> Hi all,
> Sorry to jump in in this conversation without having attended the  
> last two conference calls, due to travelling. While I agree with all  
> the statements about community based development with Sourceforge, I  
> must say that this approach has been tried unsuccessfully in  
> different sets of activities that I have been participating in the  
> past. The main problem with this is the following: source versioning  
> systems are focused on detecting changes/deltas in source code, but  
> not in ontology code. When a person makes a change in an ontology  
> with an ontology editor, the most important fact is that the  
> serialization of the ontology may be **completely different** to the  
> previous one, in terms of the ordering of the RDF triples that  
> appear in the file, what makes tracking of changes almost impossible  
> for humans.
> I think that Raúl was commenting the possibility of using  
> WebProtégé, which allows discussions over ontology terms, and  
> probably we could go for a mixture of technologies/approaches:  
> WebProtégé for the collaboration part on pure ontology development,  
> and sourceforge for the bug tracking, the community involvement, and  
> the releases of specific versions of the ontologies.
> What do you think?
> Oscar
> -----Mensaje original-----
> De: public-xg-ssn-request@w3.org [mailto:public-xg-ssn- 
> request@w3.org] En nombre de Krzysztof Janowicz
> Enviado el: jueves, 16 de julio de 2009 8:44
> Para: public-xg-ssn@w3.org
> Asunto: Re: SSN-XG Meeting Minutes 15-July-2009
> Hi,
>> Also, I like the idea presented in today’s meeting regarding posting
>> the ontology to a popular forum such as sourceforge.net using an open
>> license (e.g. Apache/BSD variant) once a suitable baseline is  
>> available.
> Thanks, there are basically three reasons why I brought this up
> yesterday. first, a platform such as sourceforge offers us a very  
> useful
> architecture. we can develop the sensor (and observation) ontology
> together using SVN as versioning system and hence document our design
> decisions (and that is what ontology is about). somebody like holger
> could act as release manager and make official releases every x weeks.
> on one side, this would give as some regular schedule (and pressure)  
> to
> make our recent changes coherent. on the other side, interested people
> can always browse the SVN at sourceforge directly to see what is
> happening right now. moreover, sourceforge offers a forum, a bug
> tracker, and especially also a feature request form. we can use these
> features to coordinate our work on the ontology but also to get  
> feedback
> from others. second, if we host the ontology (no matter in which  
> stage)
> at sourceforge people will start to use it and give us feedback.  
> this is
> also about transparency - having the ontology only on our wiki makes  
> it
> difficult for others to find out who is responsible for which parts,  
> who
> should be contacted, and so on. third, IMO the licensing issue is an
> important decision. everybody should be free to use the ontology and  
> to
> modify (fork) it if necessary (especially because our work is also  
> based
> on other ontologies). finally, having it at a platform like  
> sourceforge
> makes sure that work on the ontology can also continue (and be  
> supported
> by others) after the incubator group ran out.
> Best regards,
> Krzysztof
> Kelsey, William D schrieb:
>> Hi All,
>> I’m new to the group (today was my second meeting).  I would be
>> interested to learn if anyone has draft use cases that are driving  
>> the
>> Sensor/Observation ontology/ontologies.  If so, can they be shared?
>> Also, I like the idea presented in today’s meeting regarding posting
>> the ontology to a popular forum such as sourceforge.net using an open
>> license (e.g. Apache/BSD variant) once a suitable baseline is
>> available.  Hopefully this approach would promote increased exposure
>> for both adoption and refinement.
>> Best Regards,
>> W. David Kelsey
>> Boeing Research & Technology
>> Information Management & Transformation
>> (206)662-3963
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> *From:* Holger.Neuhaus@csiro.au [mailto:Holger.Neuhaus@csiro.au]
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 15, 2009 2:05 PM
>> *To:* public-xg-ssn@w3.org
>> *Subject:* SSN-XG Meeting Minutes 15-July-2009
>> Hi all,
>> Thank you all for a really productive meeting.
>> The draft minutes are available at:
>> http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-ssn-minutes.html
>> Please let me invite you to continue the discussion on the mailing  
>> list.
>>    *Summary of Action Items*
>> **[NEW]** **ACTION:** all discuss the versioning etc. of the ontology
>> [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-ssn-minutes.html#action01]
>> **[NEW]** **ACTION:** Cory to put up logistics page for f2f [recorded
>> in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-ssn-minutes.html#action03]
>> **[NEW]** **ACTION:** Krzysztof to organise O&M ontology meeting
>> [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/15-ssn-minutes.html#action02]
>> The XG’s Wiki page is accessible at:
>> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/ssn/wiki/Main_Page
>> Please let me invite you to use this forum for discussions on the
>> development of the Semantic Markup and the Ontology*//*
>> Cheers,
>> Holger
>> *Dr. Holger Neuhaus*
>> Post-Doctoral Research Fellow
>> Tasmanian ICT Centre
>> Phone: +61 3 6232 5547* | *Fax: +61 3 6232 5000
>> holger.neuhaus@csiro.au <mailto:holger.neuhaus@csiro.au> *|*
>> www.csiro.au <http://www.csiro.au> *|*
>> www.csiro.au/science/TasICTCentre.html
>> <http://www.csiro.au/science/TasICTCentre.html>
>> Address: GPO Box 1538, Hobart TAS 7001, Australia
>> //The Tasmanian ICT Centre is jointly funded by the Australian
>> Government through the Intelligent Island Program and CSIRO. The
>> Intelligent Island Program is administered by the Tasmanian  
>> Department
>> of Economic Development and Tourism.//
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> -- 
> Krzysztof Janowicz
> Institut für Geoinformatik
> Westfälische Wilhelms-Universität Münster
> Weseler Straße 253
> D-48151 Münster
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> fax: 0049 - 251 - 83 39763
> janowicz@uni-muenster.de
> http://ifgi.uni-muenster.de/~janowicz
> 'Die Wahrheit ist das Kind der Zeit, nicht der Autorität'
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> Versión: 8.5.375 / Base de datos de virus: 270.13.15/2239 - Fecha de  
> la versión: 07/15/09 17:58:00


John Graybeal   <mailto:graybeal@mbari.org>  -- 831-775-1956
Monterey Bay Aquarium Research Institute
Marine Metadata Interoperability Project: http://marinemetadata.org
Received on Thursday, 16 July 2009 14:55:20 UTC

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