From: Andrew Miller <amiller@cs.ucf.edu>

Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2012 12:40:48 -0400

Message-ID: <CAF7tpEz4tQ3psa34GfXFk=y0K_05idcPma1v56p9-znUgoxFTA@mail.gmail.com>

To: Melvin Carvalho <melvincarvalho@gmail.com>

Cc: Web Payments <public-webpayments@w3.org>

Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2012 12:40:48 -0400

Message-ID: <CAF7tpEz4tQ3psa34GfXFk=y0K_05idcPma1v56p9-znUgoxFTA@mail.gmail.com>

To: Melvin Carvalho <melvincarvalho@gmail.com>

Cc: Web Payments <public-webpayments@w3.org>

The relationship between Trust, the Web, and Payments is profound and deep, and Ripple is the clearest expression of this idea. The important thing to realize is that trust is inherently a weblike structure. Trust is subjective and indirect. I'm going to describe the general structure of the social graph, and explain how you get different forms by choosing the semantics of the edges. Consider a family of directed weighted graphs sharing the same nodes, where each node represents a persona - either a 'real identity' or a pseudonym. Since the graphs share the same nodes, they differ only by the edges. So by a 'family of graphs', I mean that each graph is like an overlay of links between the same set of nodes. In each case, an edge between a pair of personas represents some kind of direct relationship between the two. Given one of these graphs, and a pair of nodes/personas, what we are usually interested is observing a 'flow' of some kind, the sum of all weighted paths from A to B. In one overlay, each edge represents a credit line, where the weight is the credit limit. The flow from one person to another represents the total available credit to use as a payment. In another overlay, each edge represents an 'outstanding balance', or a debt - credit limits that have been exercised. These two overlays together are Ripple, which allows payment through indirect credit on a web. Also see "Liquidity in Credit Networks" http://arxiv.org/abs/1007.0515 In another overlay, each edge represents that one person has diligently validated the identity of another. In another overlay, each edge represents an assessment that a persona is trustworthy to perform such diligent checks. These two overlays together are the PGP web of trust, which is useful for validating identities with no central administration. In a slight variation of this, the edges represent trust in the responsible trading behavior of each person. Now we are talking about a reputation graph like Bitcoin-OTC. For an illustration, see http://serajewelks.bitcoin-otc.com/trustgraph.php?source=nanotube&dest=amiller In another overlay, each edge represents an 'insurance bond' where one person vouches for the other. The flow from A to B represents the amount of insurance payout that A could collect if B misbehaves. This graph is TrustDavis. http://www.cs.ucdavis.edu/~defigued/index_files/trustdavis.pdf Do you see that these are all inherently the same kind of weblike structure? It's disappointing that OpenTabs, for example, scopes itself out of the potential to express indirect relationships, since the credits are strictly limited to the two people who initially interacted with each other. As another example, eBay has a seller reputation, but it is global rather than weblike, and therefore also cannot express indirect trust. Bicoin-OTC is weblike, eBay ratings are not. Ripple is weblike, OpenTabs is not. Let us build more weblike things! On Sun, Sep 23, 2012 at 8:28 AM, Melvin Carvalho <melvincarvalho@gmail.com> wrote: > I'm starting to think more and more that payments and trust go hand in hand. > > This is especially true when you are establishing credit limits for issuing > new money. > > Has anyone had thoughts on this topic? > -- Andrew MillerReceived on Sunday, 23 September 2012 16:41:19 GMT

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