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Re: Problems with schema:openingHours as owl:objectProperty

From: Adrian Pohl <ad.pohl@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 11:38:41 +0100
Message-ID: <CAOtd05Fx5gg-8LuuDFy1mBE0GnxftEuq3W9OFnbdbz9ioEGtjQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: public-vocabs@w3.org
Hello Martin,

thanks for the suggestion. We will do it accordingly but - as we
currently don't use schema.org - we will rather use GoodRelations and
DC terms analogously:

<http://lobid.org/organisation/DE-380>
     <http://purl.org/goodrelations/v1#hasOpeningHoursSpecification> [
         a <http://purl.org/goodrelations/v1#OpeningHoursSpecification> ;
         <http://purl.org/dc/terms/description> "Di und Do
10.00-20.00, Mi und Fr 10.00-18.00, Sa 10.00-15.00"
         ] .

We are working on publishing the data using schema.org on a later
date, though...

All the best
Adrian

On 18 January 2013 10:48, Martin Hepp <martin.hepp@ebusiness-unibw.org> wrote:
> On Jan 18, 2013, at 9:47 AM, Adrian Pohl wrote:
>
>> We would love to use schema:openingHoursSpecification. But as I said
>> in the original mail, our base data doesn't come structured in a
>> standard way (opening hours just take one field in the underlying
>> input form and people varies accordingly), so it would be really hard
>> to convert it to a schema:OpeningHoursSpecification.
>>
>> Cheers
> Dear Adrian:
> Then simply attach the unstructured info using schema:description to the http://schema.org/OpeningHoursSpecification entity:
>
> <div itemscope itemtype="http://schema.org/Place" itemid="#store">
>   <span itemprop="name">Hepp's Happy Burger Restaurant</span>
>   <div itemprop="openingHoursSpecification" itemscope
>        itemtype="http://schema.org/OpeningHoursSpecification">
>         <span itemprop="description">Mo-Fri, 8:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m.</span>
>   </div>
> </div>
>
> This GoodRelations design principle is called "Dynamic Data Granularity"; will blog about it shortly.
>
> Martin
>
> On Jan 18, 2013, at 9:47 AM, Adrian Pohl wrote:
>
>> We would love to use schema:openingHoursSpecification. But as I said
>> in the original mail, our base data doesn't come structured in a
>> standard way (opening hours just take one field in the underlying
>> input form and people varies accordingly), so it would be really hard
>> to convert it to a schema:OpeningHoursSpecification.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Adrian
>>
>> On 17 January 2013 16:15, Martin Hepp <martin.hepp@ebusiness-unibw.org> wrote:
>>> Hi:
>>>   Is using the new, more granular opening hours pattern via
>>>
>>>> schema:openingHoursSpecification
>>>
>>> an option for you? It should offer all that you need.
>>>
>>> And while the schema.org sponsors will have to make an official statement on that, I would say that the OWL spec of schema.org is a rather sketchy thing ;-)
>>>
>>> Martin
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 17, 2013, at 12:05 PM, Adrian Pohl wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> first I'll explain the background for my question:
>>>>
>>>> - We are running a service with URIs for and RDF descriptions of
>>>> libraries and related institutions [1] and want to add human-readable
>>>> opening hours information from the source data. This opening hour
>>>> information isn't structured homogenously so that we can't transform
>>>> it to a standard syntax like ISO 8601. Thus, we want to use a RDF
>>>> property that takes plain literals in object position.
>>>>
>>>> Example: <http://lobid.org/organisation/DE-380> ex:hasOpeningHours "Di
>>>> und Do 10.00-20.00, Mi und Fr 10.00-18.00, Sa 10.00-15.00" .
>>>>
>>>> I thought that schema:openingHours might be good for this as it
>>>> doesn't require a structured Opening Hours Specification like the
>>>> property schema:openingHoursSpecification does. But I got quite
>>>> confused by the definition of schema:openingHours in the schema.org
>>>> OWL2 ontology [2] which reads:
>>>>
>>>> :openingHours
>>>>   a owl:ObjectProperty ;
>>>>   rdfs:comment "The opening hours for a business. Opening hours can
>>>> be specified as a weekly time range, starting with days, then times
>>>> per day. Multiple days can be listed with commas ',' separating each
>>>> day. Day or time ranges are specified using a hyphen '-'.<br />- Days
>>>> are specified using the following two-letter combinations:
>>>> <code>Mo</code>, <code>Tu</code>, <code>We</code>, <code>Th</code>,
>>>> <code>Fr</code>, <code>Sa</code>, <code>Su</code>.<br />- Times are
>>>> specified using 24:00 time. For example, 3pm is specified as
>>>> <code>15:00</code>.<br />Here is an example: <code>&lt;time
>>>> itemprop=&quot;openingHours&quot; datetime=&quot;Tu,Th
>>>> 16:00-20:00&quot;&gt;Tuesdays and Thursdays
>>>> 4-8pm&lt;/time&gt;</code>"@en ;
>>>>   rdfs:domain [
>>>>       a owl:Class ;
>>>>       owl:unionOf (:CivicStructure
>>>>           :LocalBusiness
>>>>       )
>>>>   ] ;
>>>>   rdfs:label "openingHours"@en ;
>>>>   rdfs:range [
>>>>       a owl:Class ;
>>>>       owl:unionOf (:Duration
>>>>       )
>>>>   ] .
>>>>
>>>> The comment says how opening hours "can" be specified, so that lets me
>>>> think I can also do it in another way. What got me confused was the
>>>> type of this property as owl:ObjectProperty and its range definition.
>>>> I haven't seen before that an owl:ObjectProperty with an owl:Class as
>>>> range is used with literals in object position. This doesn't seem
>>>> correct to me the OWL2 spec says as "Object properties connect pairs
>>>> of individuals." and "Individual := NamedIndividual |
>>>> AnonymousIndividual". [3]
>>>>
>>>> Probably, this is because of the provisional status of the schema.org
>>>> OWL ontology. Then it would be nice if this could be corrected in the
>>>> next version. Or I am missing something?
>>>>
>>>> Another possibility would be to use a blank node construction - like
>>>> e.g. GoodRelations does with quantities - but then I am missing a
>>>> property like schema:value:
>>>>
>>>> <http://lobid.org/organisation/DE-380> ex:hasOpeningHours [
>>>>   a schema:Duration ;
>>>>   schema:value "Di und Do 10.00-20.00, Mi und Fr 10.00-18.00, Sa
>>>> 10.00-15.00" # schema:value doesn't exist.
>>>>  ] .
>>>>
>>>> All the best
>>>> Adrian
>>>>
>>>> [1] http://lobid.org/organisation
>>>>
>>>> [2] http://schema.org/docs/schemaorg.owl
>>>>
>>>> [3] http://www.w3.org/TR/owl2-syntax/#Object_Properties
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------
>>> martin hepp
>>> e-business & web science research group
>>> universitaet der bundeswehr muenchen
>>>
>>> e-mail:  hepp@ebusiness-unibw.org
>>> phone:   +49-(0)89-6004-4217
>>> fax:     +49-(0)89-6004-4620
>>> www:     http://www.unibw.de/ebusiness/ (group)
>>>         http://www.heppnetz.de/ (personal)
>>> skype:   mfhepp
>>> twitter: mfhepp
>>>
>>> Check out GoodRelations for E-Commerce on the Web of Linked Data!
>>> =================================================================
>>> * Project Main Page: http://purl.org/goodrelations/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------
> martin hepp
> e-business & web science research group
> universitaet der bundeswehr muenchen
>
> e-mail:  hepp@ebusiness-unibw.org
> phone:   +49-(0)89-6004-4217
> fax:     +49-(0)89-6004-4620
> www:     http://www.unibw.de/ebusiness/ (group)
>          http://www.heppnetz.de/ (personal)
> skype:   mfhepp
> twitter: mfhepp
>
> Check out GoodRelations for E-Commerce on the Web of Linked Data!
> =================================================================
> * Project Main Page: http://purl.org/goodrelations/
>
>
>
Received on Friday, 18 January 2013 10:39:08 GMT

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