Re: Scrolling as overlap avoidance (Re: Alternative approach to scrolling, with demos)

If this includes background due to text padding settings, that should be
sufficient.

Christian


On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 2:03 PM, Loretta Guarino Reid <
lorettaguarino@google.com> wrote:

> Actually, there is a distinction between the background color just
> appearing behind the text, and the background applying to the entire
> bounding box of the cue. I think WebVTT may just provide the former, in
> which case the extra width of the cue wouldn't matter.
>
>
> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 10:56 AM, Christian Vogler <
> christian.vogler@gallaudet.edu> wrote:
>
>> This kind of background handling is definitely needed, and a background
>> stretching across the entire width would be unacceptable. Captions with
>> background are a prevalent preference among consumers.
>>
>> Christian
>>
>>
>> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 1:54 PM, Loretta Guarino Reid <
>> lorettaguarino@google.com> wrote:
>>
>>> This is a good point. The background would extend across the entire
>>> width. Philip,  supporting auto as a cue width would address this. Is that
>>> a possibility?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 10:25 AM, Christian Vogler <
>>> christian.vogler@gallaudet.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Just checking here, what does this mean for text background? Say, you
>>>> have white text on black background - will the black extend only to the
>>>> width of the actual text plus padding?
>>>>
>>>> Christian
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 11:03 AM, Philip Jägenstedt <philipj@opera.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The auto width was discussed for regions, for a single cue I think one
>>>>> should simply make the cue box as big as it can be. That is in fact
>>>>> the default size, 100%.
>>>>>
>>>>> Philip
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 4:28 PM, Loretta Guarino Reid
>>>>> <lorettaguarino@google.com> wrote:
>>>>> > Yes, an option for "auto" width would allow this. Philip and Silvia,
>>>>> is that
>>>>> > still on the table?
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> > On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 7:19 AM, Christian Vogler
>>>>> > <christian.vogler@gallaudet.edu> wrote:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> For this kind of situation, line wrapping should be considered only
>>>>> as a
>>>>> >> method of last resort. If possible, growing the cue to the left,
>>>>> right, or
>>>>> >> both, would in most cases be preferable. Especially if a line wrap
>>>>> breaks up
>>>>> >> a single word.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Christian
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Sent from my mobile phone.  Please excuse any touchscreen-induced
>>>>> >> weirdness.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> On May 8, 2014 10:09 AM, "Philip Jägenstedt" <philipj@opera.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> Thanks for digging that up, Loretta!
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> In this example, there are single cues which are positioned, not
>>>>> >>> groups of cues, so I don't think regions should be required to
>>>>> achieve
>>>>> >>> the same result.
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> With pre-regions WebVTT this could be reproduced by using the align
>>>>> >>> setting and a suitably positioned cue box, it seems.
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> Note that lineAlign:bottom only controls the alignment of the first
>>>>> >>> line, so if a cue wraps then lineAlign can't be used to provide an
>>>>> >>> anchor point for the cue as a whole, in particular you couldn't
>>>>> use it
>>>>> >>> to avoid overlapping text just below the cue.
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> I'm guessing that for speaking identification you'll place the cue
>>>>> >>> either above or below the speaker. Would a way to control the
>>>>> >>> direction in which the cue grows when the font size increases or
>>>>> lines
>>>>> >>> wraps be sufficient?
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> Philip
>>>>> >>>
>>>>> >>> On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 3:24 PM, Loretta Guarino Reid
>>>>> >>> <lorettaguarino@google.com> wrote:
>>>>> >>> > (Still trying to find non-pay examples of interesting
>>>>> placement...)
>>>>> >>> >
>>>>> >>> > Here is one, although the visual motivation for this particular
>>>>> >>> > placement
>>>>> >>> > isn't clear:
>>>>> >>> >
>>>>> >>> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NR1PO6zH60c#t=1m53s
>>>>> >>> >
>>>>> >>> > The positioned captions occur at 2:09
>>>>> >>> >
>>>>> >>> >
>>>>> >>> > On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 6:18 AM, Philip Jägenstedt <
>>>>> philipj@opera.com>
>>>>> >>> > wrote:
>>>>> >>> >>
>>>>> >>> >> [I accidentally sent this reply off-list two days ago.]
>>>>> >>> >>
>>>>> >>> >> In the CPC demo, simple left and right alignment is used to
>>>>> follow the
>>>>> >>> >> speaker:
>>>>> >>> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbqPe-IceP4
>>>>> >>> >>
>>>>> >>> >> Do you have an example where something more fancy than this is
>>>>> used?
>>>>> >>> >> Note that just by using the position, size and align setting
>>>>> you can
>>>>> >>> >> do fancier things, but an example would help determine if that's
>>>>> >>> >> enough or not.
>>>>> >>> >>
>>>>> >>> >> On Mon, May 5, 2014 at 6:31 PM, Christian Vogler
>>>>> >>> >> <christian.vogler@gallaudet.edu> wrote:
>>>>> >>> >> > To me, positioning for speaker identification makes the most
>>>>> sense
>>>>> >>> >> > in
>>>>> >>> >> > terms
>>>>> >>> >> > of the anchor point - this point is the target for each
>>>>> speaker.
>>>>> >>> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> > Christian
>>>>> >>> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> > On Mon, May 5, 2014 at 12:27 PM, David Singer <
>>>>> singer@apple.com>
>>>>> >>> >> > wrote:
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >> On May 5, 2014, at 5:00 , Philip Jägenstedt <
>>>>> philipj@opera.com>
>>>>> >>> >> >> wrote:
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >> >> (2) the background color on the width and height of the
>>>>> rollup
>>>>> >>> >> >> >> area
>>>>> >>> >> >> >> needs to be changeable
>>>>> >>> >> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >> > Why? As I noted in the "background box tweaking" thread
>>>>> that's
>>>>> >>> >> >> > still
>>>>> >>> >> >> > possible with the sum of my suggestions, but I don't
>>>>> understand
>>>>> >>> >> >> > what
>>>>> >>> >> >> > the use case is.
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >> >> (4) move all the cues in the region as a group to another
>>>>> >>> >> >> >> location
>>>>> >>> >> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >> > This is also not handled by the current spec. I don't
>>>>> think it
>>>>> >>> >> >> > makes
>>>>> >>> >> >> > sense either, why not just end the cues and repeat them in
>>>>> a new
>>>>> >>> >> >> > position?
>>>>> >>> >> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >> I agree for these that if you want something ‘similar’ to
>>>>> appear as
>>>>> >>> >> >> what’s
>>>>> >>> >> >> already there, the clean thing to do is to re-draw it.  Same
>>>>> >>> >> >> content
>>>>> >>> >> >> but in
>>>>> >>> >> >> a different region (with different position or colors), and
>>>>> so on.
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >> >> (3) font size changes on the region need to make the
>>>>> region go
>>>>> >>> >> >> >> bigger
>>>>> >>> >> >> >> centered out from the anchor point
>>>>> >>> >> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >> > That's not handled by the current spec. We've talked about
>>>>> using
>>>>> >>> >> >> > font-relative units but that hasn't happened. I'd love to
>>>>> >>> >> >> > understand
>>>>> >>> >> >> > the use case for this though. Do you have an example video
>>>>> frame
>>>>> >>> >> >> > where
>>>>> >>> >> >> > scaling around an anchor point is necessary as opposed to
>>>>> mode of
>>>>> >>> >> >> > scaling that happens with classical WebVTT?
>>>>> >>> >> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >> I also am curious
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >> David Singer
>>>>> >>> >> >> Manager, Software Standards, Apple Inc.
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >>
>>>>> >>> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> >
>>>>> >>> >> > --
>>>>> >>> >> > Christian Vogler, PhD
>>>>> >>> >> > Director, Technology Access Program
>>>>> >>> >> > Department of Communication Studies
>>>>> >>> >> > SLCC 1116
>>>>> >>> >> > Gallaudet University
>>>>> >>> >> > http://tap.gallaudet.edu/
>>>>> >>> >> > VP: 202-250-2795
>>>>> >>> >>
>>>>> >>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Christian Vogler, PhD
>>>> Director, Technology Access Program
>>>> Department of Communication Studies
>>>> SLCC 1116
>>>> Gallaudet University
>>>> http://tap.gallaudet.edu/
>>>> VP: 202-250-2795
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Christian Vogler, PhD
>> Director, Technology Access Program
>> Department of Communication Studies
>> SLCC 1116
>> Gallaudet University
>> http://tap.gallaudet.edu/
>> VP: 202-250-2795
>>
>
>


-- 
Christian Vogler, PhD
Director, Technology Access Program
Department of Communication Studies
SLCC 1116
Gallaudet University
http://tap.gallaudet.edu/
VP: 202-250-2795

Received on Thursday, 8 May 2014 18:07:18 UTC