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Minutes, 15 November 2012 SVG WG telcon

From: Erik Dahlstrom <ed@opera.com>
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2012 22:44:53 +0100
To: "public-svg-wg@w3.org" <public-svg-wg@w3.org>
Message-ID: <op.wnt303w8geuyw5@localhost.localdomain>


as plaintext:


       [1] http://www.w3.org/

                                - DRAFT -

                     SVG Working Group Teleconference

15 Nov 2012

    See also: [2]IRC log

       [2] http://www.w3.org/2012/11/15-svg-irc


           +1.415.832.aaaa, [IPcaller], ed, Doug_Schepers, krit,
           +, Tav, +, Cyril, nikos,




      * [3]Topics
          1. [4]FXTF meetings
          2. [5]diffusion curves
          3. [6]extrapolated linejoin
          4. [7]content model for svg2
      * [8]Summary of Action Items

    <trackbot> Date: 15 November 2012

    <krit> ed: If no one joins, I will scribe today. It is so much
    easier to just scribe yourself :P

    <scribe> scribeNick: ed

FXTF meetings

    DS: brought it up in CSS WG
    ... will bring it up on the mailinglist too
    ... not sure when the old telcon time was, but may not work for
    brian e.g
    ... was same time as SVG WG telcon but on mondays

    ED: for me it's mostly a concern about participation and that
    there are workitems to discuss

    DS: concerns these specs: blending&composition, masks, filter
    effects, transforms

    ED: weekly telcon? bi-weekly? or based on agenda requests?

    DS: just one meeting soon, then based on request is fine with
    ... who would call in from SVGWG?

    nikos: i'd call in

    TB: me too

    ED: probably me too

diffusion curves

    Rik: needs more research

    DS: as I understand it the diffusion curves can do some things
    meshes can't

    nikos: right, DC are easier to author

    rik: are they paint servers? how does it fit in?

    CC: you could think of DC as a representation of what flash has

    rik: no, flash doesn't have DC

    CC: no, I meant the colors on the side of the curve
    ... for SWF
    ... more like gradients than fill or stroke

    DS: if you have a path that crosses itself, does the path gets
    flattened first?

    CC: it doesn't matter if you flatten it before or after

    rik: meshes have the same issues, they're also not fill or

    DS: that means we either have DC or meshes, or both?

    CC: gradient meshes are things of today, DC is still at the
    research states, think they will solve differnt usecases

    TB: meshes are used in PDF, postscript etc, so useful to have
    ... is there a software package to play with DC somewhere?

    CC: yes, the MS tool i posted to the mailinglist has a tool
    where you can play with DCs

    TB: thinking of this from an artists standpoint

    CC: yes, you have tools that take an image and trace it, you
    can also create from scratch

    DS: do we want to resolve to not add DC to SVG2? and postpone

    TB: if we want to put it in, someone has to sign up to do the

    CC: we don't need to say anything, if someone makes a proposal
    for it we can consider it then

    (all agree)

extrapolated linejoin

    TB: would like to call it 'talon'

    <Tav> talon

    doug: where are you getting that term?

    TB: because it looks like a bird claw
    ... more unique than arc
    ... or extrapolated join
    ... because it describes the shape
    ... all the other shapes have five letters, this one is also

    CC: I don't know if talon is a good word, misleading in french

    nikos: waht does it mean in french?

    CC: the heel of a foot
    ... anyway, don't have a strong opinion on naming

    ED: for me I think arc is more natural

    TB: ok

    Doug: take this to mailinglist

content model for svg2

    DS: do we want the svg spec to say what the content model for
    elements is, or do we want to remove it from the spec?
    ... we dont' provide a DTD for SVG2 at the moment

    doug: was talking to mike smith and robin berjon about
    producing an RNG for SVG2
    ... DTDs can't express SVG very well

    DS: browsers don't validate, is that just a waste of time?

    doug: validators validate
    ... for ppl being able to validate svg

    DS: can a rect have a rect child, do we allow or disallow?

    doug: we talked before about having a fallback model, where if
    something wasn't supported it would...
    ... so that you could fallback to another element

    DS: so any arbitrary element would get treated as a <g> element
    ... is it transformable, locatable, editable?

    doug: i reckon it would be treated just like a <g>
    ... all behaviours as if the arbitary element was a <g>

    DS: but we have elements that are not transformable for
    example, so why should we assume the new element is

    doug: haven't thought deeply about that

    DS: who's working on this content model?

    doug: I don't know anybody is

    DS: seems like a huge gap in the spec
    ... what happens with elements that occur where they shouldn't
    be and so on

    ED: we should define the model, at minimal describe what
    happens. it sounds as if you're asking for someone to step up
    and do the RNG?

    DS: not sure if it needs to be an RNG, but we don't describe
    what should happen (yet)

    ED: think we should get the model proposals up on the wiki or
    something, and then discuss at the f2f
    ... one easy way is to take the model already defined in SVG
    Tiny 1.2, and backport that, then if we want to change the
    model do it afterwards
    ... there was an RNG for 1.2Full but not sure what state it's

    DS: would someone take an action for backporting the content
    model wording from 1.2T?

    <scribe> ACTION: ed to backport content model wording from 1.2T
    to SVG2 [recorded in

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-3400 - Backport content model wording
    from 1.2T to SVG2 [on Erik Dahlström - due 2012-11-22].

    next week is thanksgiving and some people won't call in, let's
    cancel next week's call

    trackbot, end telcon

Summary of Action Items

    [NEW] ACTION: ed to backport content model wording from 1.2T to
    SVG2 [recorded in

    [End of minutes]

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Erik Dahlstrom, Core Technology Developer, Opera Software
Co-Chair, W3C SVG Working Group
Personal blog: http://my.opera.com/macdev_ed
Received on Thursday, 15 November 2012 21:45:25 UTC

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