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Re: rdf-spaces

From: Gavin Carothers <gavin@carothers.name>
Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 07:54:43 -0700
Message-ID: <CAPqY83wbeXCd=Ej5s1uW9J6Y-e2ZJN3vfAVEcqcX8C4F-DM0Pg@mail.gmail.com>
To: Andy Seaborne <andy.seaborne@epimorphics.com>
Cc: public-rdf-wg@w3.org
On Wed, May 9, 2012 at 7:48 AM, Andy Seaborne
<andy.seaborne@epimorphics.com> wrote:
>
>
> On 09/05/12 15:33, David Wood wrote:
>>
>> On May 9, 2012, at 10:26, Andy Seaborne wrote:
>>
>>> On 09/05/12 15:23, David Wood wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On May 9, 2012, at 09:35, Sandro Hawke wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Following the general outcry against the term "layers", and Guus'
>>>>> endorsement of "spaces", I've renamed it for now.  So the ED is now
>>>>> here:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>  http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/rdf/raw-file/default/rdf-spaces/index.html#
>>>>>
>>>>> It's not yet clear to me what to discuss, on this topic, if we get
>>>>> there
>>>>> in today's agenda.   One thing does seem a little pressing, because it
>>>>> relates to Turtle:
>>>>>
>>>>> I think it would be great if one could use Turtle in HTML as a dataset
>>>>> language not just a graph language.   The easy way to do this would be
>>>>> to say *if* there's an "id" attribute on any of the script elements
>>>>> containing turtle, the triples parsed from that element go into a named
>>>>> graph and the rest goes into the default graph (along with any RDFa and
>>>>> microdata).
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> In spite of others' objections, I'll express some support for this idea
>>>> in general (but understand that the details would need to change).  My
>>>> company currently needs to jump through some hoops by converting RDF into
>>>> JSON either on the server side or client side in order to perform simple
>>>> operations on RDF results.  I would *love* to be able to embed Turtle as a
>>>> dataset to avoid unnecessary coding.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, my needs could be met by other means and by other WGs, but
>>>> the motivation is sound.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Why not use TriG?
>>
>>
>> I have no objection to using TriG, as long as I can use some contiguous
>> RDF serialization in HTML.  That rules out RDFa.
>>
>
> Could you explain that - the Turtle doc already has:
>
> http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/rdf/raw-file/default/rdf-turtle/index.html#in-html
>
> which is contiguous RDF serialization in HTML.
>
> It's the named graphs part that I'm missing. (JSON does not seem to help so
> I guess I didn't understand your initial remark properly.)

Also, the language in Turtle specifically talks about treating each
<script> element as it's own Turtle document. This means anyone with a
method for resolving a set of Turtle documents into a SPARQL Dataset
is very welcome to do so. But as this does not exist in practice yet
nor is there any experience to build on Turtle does NOT try and
specify how one might resolve that set of Turtle documents to a
dataset. Trying to specify a recommended behavior before there has
been any experience at all seems very poor and very hard.

--Gavin

>
>        Andy
>
>
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>>
>>
>>>
>>>        Andy
>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dave
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> It would also be nice to have a way to say one wants the triples to
>>>>> *also* go into the default graph -- so if what you're doing is graph
>>>>> annotation you don't have to repeat all the triples in the annotated
>>>>> graph.  Maybe class="included" or something; I'm not sure how the
>>>>> namespaces of HTML classes works these days.
>>>>>
>>>>> I know this touches on something Steve said yesterday about getting
>>>>> quads when you're expecting triples; I'll reply to that separately.
>>>>>
>>>>>     -- Sandro
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
Received on Wednesday, 9 May 2012 14:55:14 GMT

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