W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-rdf-wg@w3.org > June 2011

Re: keeping issue-12 simple

From: Andy Seaborne <andy.seaborne@epimorphics.com>
Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2011 10:51:16 +0100
Message-ID: <4DE75D14.8070508@epimorphics.com>
To: public-rdf-wg@w3.org
I support for the direction this is taking.

Some details to consider below inline: most important is that in SPARQL 
DATATYPE("foo@en) should be rdf:LTS.

On 01/06/11 16:04, Lee Feigenbaum wrote:
> I'd just like to reiterate my strong support for this proposal from Pat
> and Richard.
> Lee
> On 6/1/2011 10:45 AM, Pat Hayes wrote:
>> 1. We retain the current surface syntax for plain literals with and
>> without language tags. Nothing in RDF/XML or TURTLE or N-triples or
>> any other actually used syntax for RDF changes in any way.

Strong +1

We also recommend that the plain literal form is used, not ^^xsd:stringm 
on output in all serializations (including RDF graphs and SPARQL result 

libraries SHOULD output untagged plain literals in preference to 
literals with explicit datatype of xsd:string and SHOULD output tagged 
plain literals in preference to literals with datatype rdf:LTS

>> 2. Every literal has a type, which is a class name for the class of
>> possible values of all literals with that type. The type of a
>> datatyped literal is the datatype. Plain literals without language
>> tags are considered to have the type xsd:string (as SPARQL currently
>> assumes). Plain literals with language tags are considered to have a
>> new type rdf:LangTaggedString (or something shorter, to be decided. I
>> will use rdf:LTS for brevity). rdf:LTS is not, strictly speaking, a
>> datatype, since its 'lexical space' is<string, tag> pairs rather than
>> strings. but it is remarkably similar to a datatype and nothing would
>> break if you were to consider it a datatype, with the lexical space of
>> strings formed as<string>@tag and the L2V mapping L2V("sss"@ttt)
>> =<sss, ttt>

The function in SPARQL that's affected is DATATYPE(literal)

The problem is the name used is "datatype" "not "type".

DATATYPE("foo"@en) should be rdf:LTS

My preference is that L2V extended is defined to work on "sss"@ttt or 
("sss", "ttt") -- either form --

I'm happy for SPARQL is slightly misuse the word DATATYPE and return the 

The STR(literal) function will still return the string part of the value 
or lexical form.

>> 3. rdf:PlainLiteral is the superclass of xsd:string and rdf:LTS.

As we are not invoking the fact it's a datatype, I still think its 
confusing to use rdf:PlainLiteral just for it's class-feature, not it's 

The datatypes are xsd:string and rdf:LTS and rdf:PlainLiteral can't be a 
super-datatype because the lexical spaces are not compatible.

Or to put it another way rdf:PlainLiteral works perfectly well for OWL 
and RIF so leave it alone.

>> 4. The only change to the current specs is to distinguish 'type' from
>> 'datatype' and for clarity, maybe, change the terminology of 'typed
>> literal' to 'datatyped literal'. But even that is not really
>> necessary. All of this hassle comes from our insisting that the syntax
>> "foo"@baz must be a string paired with a tag, ie two syntactic items
>> rather than one.

I don't consider it two syntactic items - I see it as one item with some 
(internal) structure.

We could even make this so in Turtle and define
    <LTS> = <STRING>'@'[a-zA-Z]+ ( "-" [a-zA-Z0-9]+ )*
as a parser token.

(At the moment, langtag is a grammar rule - you can have space between 
the " and @ unfortunately.)

>> If we simply say that it represents the string
>> "foo@baz", which encodes a string and a tag and is to be used in a
>> special way determined by the datatype rdf:LTS, a way that follows the
>> existing rdf:PlainLIteral but is restricted to the tagged case, then
>> every type is a datatype and everything works smoothly, and we can
>> stop discussing this INCREDIBLY TRIVIAL matter and move on to more
>> important things. Ahem, sorry about the slight loss of control there.

I prefer extending the range of L2V to cover "sss"@ttt and define the 
RDF/XML output of xml:lang="ttt" to be "sss"@ttt


>> Pat
>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>> IHMC (850)434 8903 or (650)494 3973
>> 40 South Alcaniz St. (850)202 4416 office
>> Pensacola (850)202 4440 fax
>> FL 32502 (850)291 0667 mobile
>> phayesAT-SIGNihmc.us http://www.ihmc.us/users/phayes
Received on Thursday, 2 June 2011 09:51:49 UTC

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