W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf@w3.org > June 2007

Re: the Creative Commons take on @href everywhere

From: Mark Birbeck <mark.birbeck@x-port.net>
Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 11:34:40 +0100
Message-ID: <640dd5060706280334pedcce6bqa4af29a412f0d1f9@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Ben Adida" <ben@adida.net>
Cc: RDFa <public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf@w3.org>

Hi Ben,

:)

Ok...that's good news...I think. But we have some problems, and they
are not of our own making.

During the course of doing research to try to find a compromise for
this issue, I realised that we had no way of marking up objects that
are not information resources.

Take this example:

  <span rel="foaf:knows" href="http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf.rdf">
    ...
  </span>

The document being referred to here is an RDF/XML document, so to all
intents and purposes the fact that it is a document can be ignored.
(I.e., you cannot make any statements about this document, since the
moment you talk about 'creation date', for example, you are talking
about Ivan's birthday.)

Nothing wrong so far, we say. Since the @href doesn't appear on an <a>
then it wouldn't be legitimate to interpret the end-point as an
information resource. But what about when XHTML 2 makes all @hrefs
navigable? A precise interpretation of the mark-up (from an RDF
standpoint) would be this:

  <> foaf:knows <http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf.rdf> .
  <http://www.ivan-herman.net/foaf.rdf> rdf:type foaf:Document .

I know that we can't impose this interpretation, because it uses FOAF,
but I'm merely using the syntax as a shorthand to indicate that if
@href is navigable, then the end-point is by definition an information
resource.

The way out of this seems to me to make @resource available, so that
the small number of people who really want to create a reference to a
resource that is not an information resource can do so. I would also
prefer that we don't make @href available everywhere since I'm
increasingly coming to the conclusion that RDFa should have as little
impact on the syntax of the host language as possible.

Regards,

Mark

On 27/06/07, Ben Adida <ben@adida.net> wrote:
>
>
> Hi all,
>
> I looked into what CC's CTO and ex-CTO think of @href everywhere
> situation, given that CC's current licensing engine hands out RDFa that
> includes @href on a SPAN. It turns out that my intuition was very off:
>
> 1) they don't think @href on a SPAN implies "clickable"
>
> 2) if XHTML2 makes @href navigable in some way, they see this is a
> significant plus.
>
> As a result of this user feedback, I am changing my position on this
> issue. @href everywhere works for me. There remains a question as to
> whether we need @resource, but I am inclined to say we do not need it in
> XHTML1.1+RDFa, at this point.
>
> Steven and Mark, I appreciate your insisting on your point of view here,
>  because it pushed me to look into this more deeply and get more
> concrete user feedback.
>
> Fire away!
>
> -Ben
>
>
>


-- 
  Mark Birbeck, formsPlayer

  mark.birbeck@x-port.net | +44 (0) 20 7689 9232
  http://www.formsPlayer.com | http://internet-apps.blogspot.com

  standards. innovation.
Received on Thursday, 28 June 2007 10:34:51 UTC

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