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meeting record: 2005-10-18 RDF-in-XHTML TF

From: Ralph R. Swick <swick@w3.org>
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 11:17:11 -0400
Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.2.20051018111500.03493ec0@127.0.0.1>
To: public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf@w3.org

The [1]record of today's RDF in XHTML Task Force telecon is now available
for review.

   [1] http://www.w3.org/2005/10/18-swbp-minutes.html

A text snapshot of  revision 1.3 of 2005/10/18 15:07:46 follows:

----

SWBPD RDF-in-XHTML TF

18 Oct 2005

   [2]Agenda

      [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005Oct/0024.html

   See also: [3]IRC log

      [3] http://www.w3.org/2005/10/18-swbp-irc

Attendees

   Present
          Ralph Swick, Steven Pemberton, Ben Adida, Jeremy Carroll

   Regrets
          Mark Birbeck

   Chair
          Ben

   Scribe
          Ralph

   Previous
          [4]2005-10-11

      [4] http://www.w3.org/2005/10/11-swbp-minutes

Contents

     * Topics
         1. CURI proposal
         2. Role attribute
     * Summary of Action Items

     _____________________________________________________________

CURI proposal

   Ralph: I'm getting skepticism from the Team but I need to respond to
   the messages and explain that yes, we've considered all of the
   alternatives that people have mentioned

   Ben: we may not be able to reach a consensus here before the WG F2F

   Ralph I would prefer if we had a more definitive proposal in time for
   the F2F

   Jeremy: I told my HP colleagues that Mark's CURI proposal addresses
   both the qname and the bnode issues
   ... and it's the least ugly of the alternatives we have considered
   ... I don't think any of the possibilities are really attractive

   Ben: the ugliness only occurs when you actually use bnodes or qnames
   in an href
   ... i.e. only when you're trying to squeeze [octets] or using more
   complex RDF

   Jeremy: some people point out that additional attributes have that
   same characteristic; you only see the comnplication when you need to
   use it
   ... but that feels to me like a larger learning curve

   Ralph: I agree; learning more attributes seems more complicated than
   learning a square-bracket syntax

   ACTION: Ben put notes in the Web from Boston discussion with Mark
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/11-swbp-minutes.html#action05]
   [CONTINUES]

   Ben: some progress; see [10]RDF in XHTML Taskforce - RDF/A Examples
   ... haven't finished all the examples yet
   ... by next week we hope to have some version of RDF/A spec based on
   these notes and on a CURI resolution
   ... let's work on 2 documents; (1) a primer on how to add metadata to
   an HTML document and (2) a formal specification of RDF/A

     [10] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-rdfa

   Ralph: I'd give priority to the formal specification of RDF/A as
   that's what Jeremy needs to show implementability and what I think the
   WG will need for the f2f

   Jeremy: agree, but the primer will also be useful at the F2F so we
   should get some words in there also
   ... my priority for the WG is to get a new version of the XML Schema
   Datatypes document out, so this TF comes second in priority

   ACTION: Ben summarize the question of semantics of the HTML role
   attribute and solicit feedback from RDF experts
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/04-swbp-minutes.html#action01]
   [DONE]

   -> [12]Question from the RDF-in-XHTML task force on the HTML Role
   Attribute [Ben 2005-10-17]

     [12] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/semantic-web/2005Oct/0161.html

   ([13]CC'd to public-rdf-in-xhtml task)

     [13] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005Oct/0019.html

   Ben: I hope to have a document for review over the weekend
   ... so we can discuss reviews at next Tuesday's telecon
   ... will coordinate with Mark on this

   Ben: anything shocking yet in this [14]RDF/A examples draft?

     [14] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-rdfa

   Steven: no

   Ben: in the "[15]Metadata About Other Documents" example, we don't
   have a way to say "here's an image" and "here's some metadata about
   that image" without repeating the URI
   ... do we want to consider this case?

     [15] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-rdfa#other

   Jeremy: could we consider using href?

   ACTION: Ben add repeating URI in IMG case to issues list
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/18-swbp-minutes.html#action03]

   Steven: IMG is no longer empty in XHTML2
   ... the content replaces the ALT attribute; it's fallback if the image
   is not available

   Ralph: I'm ok with adding this as an issue but one alternative is to
   repeat the URIs -- i.e. I'm not persuaded yet that this is a problem
   that we need to solve

   <Steven> <img src="photo2.jpg" href="photo2.jpg" rev="dc:author"
   content="Steven Pemberton" />

   <Steven> No, that doesn't work... rev doesn't take content="..."

   <Steven> <img src="photo2.jpg" about="photo2.jpg" rel="dc:author"
   content="Steven Pemberton" />

   Ben: I expect that this [17]2005-rdfa draft will evolve to become part
   of the primer

     [17] http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/HTML/2005-rdfa

   ACTION: Mark write CURI specification by 10 Oct
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/04-swbp-minutes.html#action02]
   [CONTINUES]

   [Mark: in [19]mail ] "I will have the CURIE note available in the
   next couple of days,"

     [19] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005Oct/0031.html


Role attribute

   Ben: Ivan Herman suggests we're trying to do to much in [20]his
   response to the role question

     [20] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005Oct/0030.html

   Steven: I don't agree with Ivan; if we can find a way to use it this
   will be an expressive addition

   Steven: I had some trouble understanding the distinction Geoff
   Chappell is making in
   [21]his reply on the role question
   ... need to think about this more
   ... regrets for next Tuesday's telecon

     [21] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2005Oct/0028.html

   ACTION: Steven track and report on Role discussion before next Tuesday
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/18-swbp-minutes.html#action05]

   ACTION: Ralph and Ben to augment the issues list
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/09/27-swbp-irc#T14-30-04]
   [CONTINUES]

   Ben: our goal should be to have a document that Jeremy can use to test
   implementation before the f2f

   ACTION: Mark and Ben to check edge cases of inheritance in RDF/A
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/07/26-swbp-minutes.html#action06]
   [CONTINUES]

   ACTION: Ben to put together the "ACID" test for XHTML2 RDF/A
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/07/26-swbp-minutes.html#action02]
   [CONTINUES]

   [adjourned]


Summary of Action Items

   [NEW] ACTION: Ben add repeating URI in IMG case to issues list
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/18-swbp-minutes.html#action03]

   [NEW] ACTION: Steven track and report on Role discussion before next
   Tuesday
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/18-swbp-minutes.html#action05]

   [PENDING] ACTION: Ben put notes in the Web from Boston discussion with
   Mark [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/11-swbp-minutes.html#action05]

   [PENDING] ACTION: Ben to put together the "ACID" test for XHTML2 RDF/A
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/07/26-swbp-minutes.html#action02]

   [PENDING] ACTION: Mark and Ben to check edge cases of inheritance in
   RDF/A [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/07/26-swbp-minutes.html#action06]

   [PENDING] ACTION: Mark write CURI specification by 10 Oct
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/04-swbp-minutes.html#action02]

   [PENDING] ACTION: Ralph and Ben to augment the issues list
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/09/27-swbp-irc#T14-30-04]

   [DONE] ACTION: Ben summarize the question of semantics of the HTML
   role attribute and solicit feedback from RDF experts
   [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/10/04-swbp-minutes.html#action01]

   [End of minutes]

   Change Log:
$Log: 18-swbp-minutes.html,v $
Revision 1.3  2005/10/18 15:07:46  swick
Remove some gratuitous in-your-face URIs

Revision 1.2  2005/10/18 14:58:19  swick
Cleanup for publication

     _____________________________________________________________

$Date: 2005/10/18 15:07:46 $
Received on Tuesday, 18 October 2005 15:17:29 GMT

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