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Re: Response to your MAUR Comments

From: Joshua A. Miele <jam@ski.org>
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 2015 13:19:29 -0700
To: Janina Sajka <janina@rednote.net>
CC: <public-pfwg-comments@w3.org>
Message-ID: <560D9551.50304@ski.org>
Dear Janina:

I have reviewed the group's responses to my comments and am satisfied 
with the resolution. Thanks for including me in the process and 
listening to my concerns.

--JAM

----------------------------------------
Joshua A. Miele, Ph.D., Associate Director of Technology Research and Development
The Smith-Kettlewell Rehabilitation Engineering Research Center
      on Low Vision and Blindness
2318 Fillmore St.
San Francisco, CA 94115

Phone: 415/345-2113
E-Mail: jam@ski.org
Web: http://www.ski.org/Rehab




On 9/30/2015 7:17 PM, Janina Sajka wrote:
> Dear Josh:
>
> Thank you for your comments on the Media Accessibility User Requirements
> (MAUR):
>
> http://w3c.github.io/pfwg/media-accessibility-reqs/
>
> The Protocols and Formats Working Group, together with the Media Subteam of
> the HTML-A11Y Task Force, has now reviewed all comments received on the draft.
> We would like to know whether we have understood your comments correctly and
> whether you are satisfied with our resolutions.
>
> All comments received together with notes on our disposition of each comment
> are logged on the wiki at:
>
> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/HTML/wiki/MAUR_Comment_Processing_2
>
> Please review our resolutions for your comments at the above URI, and reply to
> us by Thursday 15 October to say whether you accept them or to discuss
> additional concerns you have with our response. If we do not hear from you by
> that date, we will mark your comment as "no response" and close it. If you
> need more time to consider your acknowledgement, please let us know. You can
> respond by email by replying to this message. Note that this list is publicly
> archived.
>
> Note that if you still strongly disagree with our resolution on an issue, you
> have the opportunity to file a formal objection (according to 3.3.2 of the W3C
> Process, at
> http://www.w3.org/2005/10/Process-20051014/policies.html#WGArchiveMinorityViews)
> Formal objections will be reviewed during the transition meeting with the W3C
> Director, unless we can come to agreement with you on a resolution in advance
> of the meeting.
>
> Thank you for your time reviewing and sending comments. Though we cannot
> always do exactly what each commenter requests, all comments are valuable to
> the development process.
>
> Regards,
>
> Janina Sajka, Chair
> Protocols and Formats WG
>
>
> Janina Sajka writes:
>> Colleagues:
>>
>> Attached here are comments provided by Josh Miele of Smith-Kettlewell
>> Institute.
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> Janina Sajka,	Phone:	+1.443.300.2200
>> 			sip:janina@asterisk.rednote.net
>> 		Email:	janina@rednote.net
>>
>> Linux Foundation Fellow
>> Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup:	http://a11y.org
>>
>> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
>> Chair,	Protocols & Formats	http://www.w3.org/wai/pf
>> 	Indie UI			http://www.w3.org/WAI/IndieUI/
>>
>> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2015 13:16:55 -0800
>> From: "Joshua A. Miele" <jam@ski.org>
>> X-CRM114-Status: GOOD (  14.38  )
>>
>> Janina:
>>
>> Here are my notes from our conversation earlier this week. I will try to
>> send the list of terminology in a few days.
>>
>> Thanks again for a great conversation, and for being open to my feedback.
>> Also nice to reconnect!
>>
>> --JAM
>>
>> 3.1 intro should not reference any of the stylistic preferences or
>> guidelines for description (e.g., voicing, objectivity, timing), but should
>> reference existing guidelines such as the DCMP description key.
>>
>> There is a list of different description approaches in the intro. What are
>> the items in this list. Should it be a definition list?
>>
>> In addition to talking about monolithic description tracks, please talk
>> about atomic description where individual description clips are synced with
>> video.
>>
>> What about DV4. Does it really have to be real human speech? What about
>> clips vs track?
>>
>> If DV5 and DV6 regarding independent volume controls for program and
>> descriptive audio are requirements, then Open Description does not comply
>>
>> DV12 seems funny. Why address this specific buggy behavior? It seems like
>> there are lots of undesirable behaviors we could call out, but this should
>> not be a list of possible programming errors.
>>
>> What about multiple, simultaneous description tracks, such as might be
>> desirable for different tracks voicing different information types, or for
>> subtitled films where different voices would read different characters, and
>> describer of visual elements; might want these voices in separate locations.
>>
>> TVD requirements talk a lot about UA/ST TTS options to be supported. There
>> is significant overlap here with DV list and extended requirements
>>
>> Discuss hybrid extended/inline case.
>>
>> Consider content navigation by description element Is this what 4.2
>> Granularity level control for structural navigation is getting at?
>>
>>
>> Structural opinion about this document: the lists of requirements [dv] [td],
>> pcc[, etc, should be marked up as lists or otherwise
>>
>> On 2/9/2015 12:28 PM, Janina Sajka wrote:
>>> Hi, Josh:
>>>
>>> 1PM Pacific Tuesday would be 4PM Eastern, and that works perfectly for
>>> me. Do you want to call me? Best number is:
>>>
>>> +1 202 494 7040
>>>
>>> Looking forward to catching up with you.
>>>
>>> Janina
>>>
>>> Joshua A. Miele writes:
>>>> Janina:
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for following up -- I'd love to have a talk. I do have some thoughts
>>>> about the document and have been slammed, so haven't had time to write about
>>>> them.
>>>>
>>>> Any chance we could schedule a call Tuesday, 2/10 at 1:00 Pacific?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks!
>>>>
>>>> --JAM
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 2/9/2015 9:39 AM, Janina Sajka wrote:
>>>>> Hi, Josh:
>>>>>
>>>>> Just a quick resend of my email from the past week following up on the
>>>>> W3C Media Accessibility User Requirements document.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you had opportunity to review it? Should we chat sometime soon?
>>>>> Please let me know what works for you.
>>>>>
>>>>> tia
>>>>>
>>>>> Janina
>>>>>
>>>>> Janina Sajka writes:
>>>>>> Hi, Josh:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We've not managed to have the telephone conversation we exchanged email
>>>>>> about, but I have good opportunity to do so over the next couple weeks.
>>>>>> Did you find items we should discuss? Do you want to propose some times
>>>>>> to talk?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best days for me are Tuesdays and Fridays. Mondays are also pretty good
>>>>>> for me, Wednesdays and Thursdays not so good. Let me know what might
>>>>>> work for you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Janina
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Judy Brewer writes:
>>>>>>> Hi Josh, Janina,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Did you manage to connect yet on the Media User Accessibility Requirements?
>>>>>>> That work is coming to a close soon so we should capture your input, Josh,
>>>>>>> if you think we're missing some things.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And Josh and Philippe, do you both have any time on Friday, afternoon for
>>>>>>> Philippe and me, morning for Josh, when we could talk for half an hour to
>>>>>>> introduce Josh to the WebVTT and Timed Text work going on here at W3C? For
>>>>>>> instance, would 10am Pacific, 1pm Eastern, be possible?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Judy
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 1/8/2015 8:02 PM, Joshua A. Miele wrote:
>>>>>>>> Judy -- thank you for the intros!
>>>>>>>> Philippe -- I look forward to speaking with you.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Janina:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's really great to be back in touch!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks so much for sharing the link to the MAUR. I will not be able to
>>>>>>>> make the scheduled meeting on Monday, but I am extremely excited to have
>>>>>>>> the opportunity to provide feedback for this document. I have already
>>>>>>>> given it a quick look and it has set my thought wheels in motion.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm not sure if you're familiar with YouDescribe -- a description tool we
>>>>>>>> have been developing here at Smith-Kettlewell -- but it brings a number of
>>>>>>>> these issues out of the theoretical and into the concrete. Based on user
>>>>>>>> feedback about our admittedly rudimentary feature set, I think I have a
>>>>>>>> few things to contribute to the MAUR.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You can check it out at:
>>>>>>>> http://youdescribe.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think it might be helpful for me to review the document a little more
>>>>>>>> closely, and then maybe have a realtime conversation with you, Janina. I
>>>>>>>> want to make sure my feedback is valuable, so I'd like to chat about stuff
>>>>>>>> a little before committing detailed comments to text.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> One of the things I'd like to discuss is the separation of traditional
>>>>>>>> (i.e., inline) description versus extended description. our tool allows
>>>>>>>> for both types of description in any given video, and I think they are not
>>>>>>>> as different as this document might make them seem.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'd also like to discuss the assumption that a description track is a
>>>>>>>> monolithic audio track -- we do it with individual audio clips for each
>>>>>>>> atomic bit of description, and we think its important to include this
>>>>>>>> concept in the enumeration of use cases.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'd love to talk before going much further in my feedback.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm really sorry, but tomorrow and Monday are really tight. Any chance we
>>>>>>>> can schedule some time next week? I'm available on Wednesday morning
>>>>>>>> (Pacific -- early afternoon eastern). Let me know if that might work.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks so much for allowing me to discuss this with you!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --JAM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 1/8/2015 1:06 PM, Janina Sajka wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Hello, Josh:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Great to be in communication with you again, and Happy New Year to you.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I welcome your perspectives on our Media Accessibility User Requirements
>>>>>>>>> document. We do believe we're pretty complete, but we also did not place
>>>>>>>>> great emphasis on viewing the issues from a mobile perspective. So, your
>>>>>>>>> input would be most welcome, even this late in our process. Certainly,
>>>>>>>>> we don't want to publish something less than the best thinking
>>>>>>>>> available.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The latest editor's draft of the MAUR is at:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://w3c.github.io/pfwg/media-accessibility-reqs/
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Our next scheduled teleconference on this document is this coming
>>>>>>>>> Monday, January 12 at 4PM Boston / 1PM San Francisco. If you can join
>>>>>>>>> the call, that would be fabulous. I'll cc you when I send the agenda
>>>>>>>>> Friday.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> If the telecon doesn't work for you, please let me know how we can best
>>>>>>>>> get your input. I'm happy to have an individual call with you, if that
>>>>>>>>> would be better. I look forward to talking with you soon.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Janina
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Judy Brewer writes:
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Josh! And happy New Year!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In December we were talking about some work you were doing at
>>>>>>>>>> Smith-Kettlewell on video mobile accessibility, and how that might
>>>>>>>>>> relate to
>>>>>>>>>> two things under development in Web standards at W3C.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Here are two introductions -- or rather one re-introduction and a new
>>>>>>>>>> intro
>>>>>>>>>> -- that are both timely for the beginning of January.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The re-introduction:
>>>>>>>>>> Janina Sajka is wrapping up work on the Media Accessibility User
>>>>>>>>>> Requirements (MAUR) document through the Media Accessibility Group of
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> HTML Accessibility Task Force. They're close to publishing a final
>>>>>>>>>> version
>>>>>>>>>> of that, but I think you and she should talk to make sure that the user
>>>>>>>>>> requirements that you've been working with are covered. And actually,
>>>>>>>>>> there's a Media Accessibility Group meeting this coming Monday,
>>>>>>>>>> January 12
>>>>>>>>>> that might be good for you to visit, if you're available then.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Janina, I don't have links handy for the latest editor's draft of
>>>>>>>>>> MAUR, or
>>>>>>>>>> the Media group's meeting time&   coordinates for Monday. Could you
>>>>>>>>>> please
>>>>>>>>>> send those to Josh? (And also please copy me as I'd like to take a
>>>>>>>>>> look at
>>>>>>>>>> the latest.) And Josh my suggestion would be that you talk with Janina
>>>>>>>>>> rather quickly, if your schedule allows, so that you can jointly assess
>>>>>>>>>> whether or not the requirements you've been researching are adequately
>>>>>>>>>> covered.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The new introduction:
>>>>>>>>>> Philippe le Hegaret is Interaction Domain Lead for W3C (sort of like
>>>>>>>>>> my role
>>>>>>>>>> for WAI, except he does it for HTML&   a ton of other Web
>>>>>>>>>> specifications).
>>>>>>>>>> One of his working groups is working on both WebVTT and Timed Text. We
>>>>>>>>>> want
>>>>>>>>>> to make sure that the requirements that we've captured in MAUR are
>>>>>>>>>> reflected
>>>>>>>>>> as much as possible in WebVTT and Timed Text, and I think there was a
>>>>>>>>>> particular feature compatibility issue -- perhaps how to handle
>>>>>>>>>> multiple
>>>>>>>>>> captioning streams and/or multiple video description streams, or both
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> where I think this intersected with an issue that Philippe and I had
>>>>>>>>>> tentatively identified a while back as a possible gap.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So Josh and Philippe, my suggestion would be that we figure out a time
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> talk in the next week or two. But it would probably be helpful to
>>>>>>>>>> exchange
>>>>>>>>>> some info up front by email. Josh, do you recall more details about the
>>>>>>>>>> particular requirements and/or feature(s) that you mentioned concerns
>>>>>>>>>> about
>>>>>>>>>> when we spoke in December?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> And actually, these discussions about requirements and implementations
>>>>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>>>>> related, so we might want to keep the thread going between both areas.
>>>>>>>>>> Thoughts welcome.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks and best,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> - Judy
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> Judy Brewer
>>>>>>>>>> Director, Web Accessibility Initiative
>>>>>>>>>> at the World Wide Web Consortium (W3C)
>>>>>>>>>> 32 Vassar St. Room G-526, MIT/CSAIL
>>>>>>>>>> Cambridge MA 02149 USA
>>>>>>>>>> www.w3.org/WAI/
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Judy Brewer
>>>>>>> Director, Web Accessibility Initiative
>>>>>>> at the World Wide Web Consortium (W3C)
>>>>>>> 32 Vassar St. Room G-526, MIT/CSAIL
>>>>>>> Cambridge MA 02149 USA
>>>>>>> www.w3.org/WAI/
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Janina Sajka,	Phone:	+1.443.300.2200
>>>>>> 			sip:janina@asterisk.rednote.net
>>>>>> 		Email:	janina@rednote.net
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Linux Foundation Fellow
>>>>>> Executive Chair, Accessibility Workgroup:	http://a11y.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), Web Accessibility Initiative (WAI)
>>>>>> Chair,	Protocols&  Formats	http://www.w3.org/wai/pf
>>>>>> 	Indie UI			http://www.w3.org/WAI/IndieUI/
>>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> ----------------------------------------
>>>> Joshua A. Miele, Ph.D., Director
>>>> The Smith-Kettlewell Video Description Research and Development Center
>>>> 2318 Fillmore St.
>>>> San Francisco, CA 94115
>>>>
>>>> Phone: 415/345-2113
>>>> E-Mail: jam@ski.org
>>>> Web: http://www.vdrdc.org
>>>> Twitter: @VDRDC
>

-- 
Received on Sunday, 4 October 2015 16:43:21 UTC

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