- From: Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org>
- Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2012 18:08:50 +0100
- To: "public-multilingualweb-lt@w3.org" <public-multilingualweb-lt@w3.org>
- Message-ID: <50B4F3A2.8070905@w3.org>
... are at http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html and below as
text. Thanks a lot to Dave, David, Jirka, Karl, Pablo and Yves for
making the extra effort. We went through the normative sections 3-5.
Then we moved the sections about HTML to 6-7 and went through these
sections. Data category sections are not done yet.
We didn't make any major changes like adding or removing attributes,
except provenance global rules, see
http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#item02
Yves will make an update to the provenance section, probably also taking
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-multilingualweb-lt/2012Nov/0218.html
into account, and send it to the list.
Tomorrow and on Thursday there will further calls, see
http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#item22
Wednesday start 1 p.m. UTC, Thursday start 2 p.m. UTC.
Best,
Felix
[1]W3C
[1] http://www.w3.org/
- DRAFT -
MLW-LT editing call
27 Nov 2012
See also: [2]IRC log
[2] http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-irc
Attendees
Present
karl, yves, felix, Yves_, dave, david, jirka, pnietoca
Regrets
Chair
felix
Scribe
fsasaki
Contents
* [3]Topics
1. [4]work plan / agenda check
2. [5]Global rules for provenance discussion
3. [6]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/
drafts/its20/its20.html#notation-terminology
4. [7]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/
drafts/its20/its20.html#def-schemalanguage
5. [8]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/
drafts/its20/its20.html#def-datacat
6. [9]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/
drafts/its20/its20.html#def-selection
7. [10]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html#iri-usage
8. [11]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html#conformance
9. [12]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html#conformance-product-schema
10. [13]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html##conformance-product-processi
ng-expectations
11. [14]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html#conformance-product-html-proc
essing-expectations
12. [15]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html#its-processing
13. [16]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html#datacategory-locations
14. [17]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html##selection-global
15. [18]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt
/drafts/its20/its20.html#selectors
16. [19]"5.4 Link to External Rules"
17. [20]"5.5 Precedence between Selections"
18. [21]"5.6 Associating ITS Data Categories with Existing
Markup"
19. [22]5.7 Conversion to NIF
20. [23]"5.8 ITS Tools Annotation"
21. [24]test suite
22. [25]next call
* [26]Summary of Action Items
__________________________________________________________
work plan / agenda check
waiting for people to come ...
Global rules for provenance discussion
basis for discussion is
[27]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-multilingualweb-
lt/2012Nov/0186.html
[27] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-multilingualweb-lt/2012Nov/0186.html
dave: yves' points are correct
... there is no way of writing a global pointer rule which is
aware of values in the xliff
... even if we could figure out the xpath, you would need
something in the rule to filter out things in the phase group
that did not map to "revision"
... because you cannot differentiate phase groups in the way
needed
... this topic, plus toolsRef issues
... plus if you want to do mapping between phase group and
rules, you need more than pointer rules
... I'd say let's get rid of pointer rules
... appart of standoff pointers
[28]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/i
ts20/its20.html#provenance-global
[28] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#provenance-global
"provenanceRecordsRefPointer"
everything else would be deleted. That is: "personPointer,
personRefPointer, orgPointer, orgRefPointer, toolPointer,
toolRefPointer, revPersonPointer, revPersonRefPointer,
revOrgPointer, revOrgRefPointer, revToolPointer,
revToolRefPointer and provRefPointer"
<scribe> ACTION: jirka to take
[29]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-irc#T13-11-02 for the
ITS 2.0 schema into account [recorded in
[30]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action01]
[29] http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-irc#T13-11-02
<trackbot> Created ACTION-325 - Take
[31]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-irc#T13-11-02 for the
ITS 2.0 schema into account [on Jirka Kosek - due 2012-12-04].
[31] http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-irc#T13-11-02
<pnietoca> sorry i'm late
[32]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#notation-terminology
[32] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#notation-terminology
drop relax ng namespace, not used in the spec
added html namespace
[33]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#def-schemalanguage
[33] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#def-schemalanguage
dropping complete section
[34]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#def-datacat
[34] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#def-datacat
"The concept of a data category is independent of its
implementation in an XML environment" > The concept of a data
category is independent of its implementation in an XML and
HTML environment"
[35]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#def-selection
[35] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#def-selection
"parts of an XML document " > "parts of an XML or HTML
document"
"Selection relies on the information that is given in the XML
Information Set [XML Infoset]. ITS applications MAY implement
inclusion mechanisms such as XInclude or DITA's [DITA 1.0]
conref."
drop the paragraph
[36]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#iri-usage
[36] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#iri-usage
<scribe> ACTION: felix to update list or IRI attributes at
[37]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/i
ts20/its20.html#iri-usage [recorded in
[38]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action02]
[37] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#iri-usage
<trackbot> Created ACTION-326 - Update list or IRI attributes
at
[39]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/i
ts20/its20.html#iri-usage [on Felix Sasaki - due 2012-12-04].
[39] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#iri-usage
action-326: not needed, handled during editing call
<trackbot> ACTION-326 Update list or IRI attributes at
[40]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/i
ts20/its20.html#iri-usage notes added
[40] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#iri-usage
close action-326
<trackbot> ACTION-326 Update list or IRI attributes at
[41]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/i
ts20/its20.html#iri-usage closed
[41] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#iri-usage
<scribe> dropped attribute list, reffering now only to RELAX NG
schema and the anyURI data types
[42]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#conformance
[42] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#conformance
make sure that everything will say "HTML" or "HTML5"?
jirka: w3c working group said they will use html versioning
... to avoid perception that ITS cannot be applied to HTML6
david: future proof is good
... but it is not valid HTML4
... you could say "HTML5 and higher"
karl: could say HTML and in an introduction we say "HTML is
defined by HTML5 or its successor"
added a subsection in the terminology section, see
www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.
html##def-html
[43]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#conformance-product-schema
[43] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#conformance-product-schema
"[Ed. note: Below statement about schemas is wrong if the ITS
schemas will be normative.]": deleting note
[44]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html##conformance-product-processing-expectations
[44] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html
"[Ed. note: All traces of HTML has to be removed if we will
proceed with CT 3 and HTML+ITS CC.]": note from Jirka
everyone is happy with separate html confirmance type, so can
remove note
deleting all traces of HTML and HTML5 in this section, since
there is now a separate conformacne type for html5
<Yves_> [45]https://github.com/finnle/ITS-2.0-Testsuite
[45] https://github.com/finnle/ITS-2.0-Testsuite
[46]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#conformance-product-html-processing-expectations
[46] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#conformance-product-html-processing-expectations
discussed "processing expecations" vs "processing
requirements", might change terminology (not normative def)
during last call
<scribe> ACTION: Jirka to go through document and replace HTML5
> HTML [recorded in
[47]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action03]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-327 - Go through document and replace
HTML5 > HTML [on Jirka Kosek - due 2012-12-04].
[48]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#its-processing
[48] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#its-processing
[49]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#datacategory-locations
[49] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#datacategory-locations
discussion on "standoff markup", related to "location", but
somehow different, not added here
[50]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html##selection-global
[50] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html
delete ruby mentions throughout section 5.2
"The content model of span permits arbitrary nesting of ruby
markup, since the rt element can contain span. An application
of ruby, however, MUST not use such arbitrary nesting.":
deleted, ruby not needed here
[51]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/i
ts20.html#selectors
[51] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#selectors
"The following attributes point to existing information:":
deleted pointer attributes not needed anymore
scribe: after the "pointer in provenacne" discussion today
"5.3.3 CSS Selectors"
"5.3.4 Additional query languages"
"5.3.5 Variables in selectors"
"5.4 Link to External Rules"
<scribe> ACTION: felix to create example with rules element in
sec. 5.4 - due 15 december [recorded in
[52]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action04]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-328 - create example with rules
element in sec. 5.4 [on Felix Sasaki - due 2012-12-15].
"5.5 Precedence between Selections"
"Implicit Local selection in documents" > not inherited local
selection is meant?
"Implicit Local selection in documents" > Selection via local
ITS markup in documents
"Implicit Local selection in documents" > Selection via
explicit (that is not inherited) local ITS markup in documents
keep as is, may clarify during LC phase
<pnietoca> the same happens in point 7.5
<pnietoca> so if you're going to change it you have to change
both
tx, pnietoca, will take that into account during LC too
"5.6 Associating ITS Data Categories with Existing Markup"
<pnietoca> sorry folks I have to leave, besides my microphone
it's not working I don't know why!, I'm trying to speak but I
can't
<pnietoca> I hope to have it fixed next time
sure, thanks for being here, pnietoca!
<pnietoca> anyway I 'll send a number of misprints and other
things I noticed during the revision
<pnietoca> to the list
<pnietoca> cheers, bye!
discussing position of sec 7 "Using ITS Markup in HTML5"
<daveL> suggest text for last note in 5.5, change "and these
are overridden via local markup." to "which are in turn
overridden by local markup"
<scribe> done
sec 7 "Using ITS Markup in HTML5" is now sec 6, old sec 6 is
sec 7
sec 8 about xhtml now also moved, is new sec 7, old sec 6 is
sec 8
5.7 Conversion to NIF
remove mentions of ontology
1 hour break
<Yves_> Sorry: i wasn't able to do diddly-squat on updating the
provenance section
[53]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/i
ts20/its20.html#conversion-to-nif
[53] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#conversion-to-nif
"5.8 ITS Tools Annotation"
dave, felix - need a running list of all the MUST statements
and make sure that we have a test
test suite
"The data category identifier MUST be one of the following
identifiers" example of a statement that needs testing to
<scribe> ACTION: felix to come up with running list of MUST
statements for testing - due december 15 [recorded in
[54]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action05]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-329 - come up with running list of
MUST statements for testing [on Felix Sasaki - due 2012-12-15].
<scribe> ACTION: felix to move data category identifiers to
table in 8.1 Position, Defaults, Inheritance and Overriding of
Data Categories [recorded in
[55]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action06]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-330 - Move data category identifiers
to table in 8.1 Position, Defaults, Inheritance and Overriding
of Data Categories [on Felix Sasaki - due 2012-12-04].
replacing lq-issues with lq-issue in identifer list
"Inline global rules MUST be specified inside script which has
type attribute with the value application/xml or
application/its+xml. "
in 6.3 Inline Global Rules in HTML5
"with the value application/xml or application/its+xml." >
"with the value application/its+xml."
"The script element itself MUST be child of head element." >
"The script element itself SHOULD be child of head element."
6.4 Standoff Markup in HTML5
"In HTML5 the standoff markup MUST be stored inside a script
element with its id attribute that MUST be set to the same
value as the xml:id attribute of the provenanceRecords element
it contains." > "In HTML5 the standoff markup MUST be stored
inside a script element. It MUST have a type attribute with the
value application/its+xml. Its id attribute that MUST be set to
the same value as the...
...xml: id attribute of the provenanceRecords element it
contains."
same change for lq issue
"6.5 Precedence between Selections"
"Note: If identical selections are defined in different rules
elements within one document, the selection defined by the last
takes precedence.": removing the note in sec. 5.5 Precedence
between Selections
same for 6.5 Precedence between Selections
added note from XML section 5.5 "ITS does not define precedence
related to rules defined or linked based on non-ITS mechanisms
(such as processing instructions for linking rules)." to HTML
section 6.5
"7 Using ITS Markup in XHTML"
<scribe> ACTION: karl to create xhtml example for 7 Using ITS
Markup in XHTML [recorded in
[56]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action07]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-331 - Create xhtml example for 7
Using ITS Markup in XHTML [on Karl Fritsche - due 2012-12-04].
next call
karl could do wed, felix not wed, but thur
dave from 1-3 p.m. utc
on thursday
and wed too
yves better on wed
felix on thur 2 p.m. utc - later
yves: will modify proveance ot remove pointers
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: felix to come up with running list of MUST
statements for testing - due december 15 [recorded in
[57]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action05]
[NEW] ACTION: felix to create example with rules element in
sec. 5.4 - due 15 december [recorded in
[58]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action04]
[NEW] ACTION: felix to move data category identifiers to table
in 8.1 Position, Defaults, Inheritance and Overriding of Data
Categories [recorded in
[59]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action06]
[NEW] ACTION: felix to update list or IRI attributes at
[60]http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/i
ts20/its20.html#iri-usage [recorded in
[61]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: Jirka to go through document and replace HTML5 >
HTML [recorded in
[62]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action03]
[NEW] ACTION: jirka to take
[63]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-irc#T13-11-02 for the
ITS 2.0 schema into account [recorded in
[64]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: karl to create xhtml example for 7 Using ITS
Markup in XHTML [recorded in
[65]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html#action07]
[60] http://www.w3.org/International/multilingualweb/lt/drafts/its20/its20.html#iri-usage
[63] http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-irc#T13-11-02
[End of minutes]
__________________________________________________________
Minutes formatted by David Booth's [66]scribe.perl version
1.137 ([67]CVS log)
$Date: 2012-11-27 16:58:42 $
__________________________________________________________
[66] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
[67] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/
Scribe.perl diagnostic output
[Delete this section before finalizing the minutes.]
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.137 of Date: 2012/09/20 20:19:01
Check for newer version at [68]http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/
scribe/
[68] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/
Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00)
No ScribeNick specified. Guessing ScribeNick: fsasaki
Inferring Scribes: fsasaki
Present: karl yves felix Yves_ dave david jirka pnietoca
Got date from IRC log name: 27 Nov 2012
Guessing minutes URL: [69]http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.ht
ml
People with action items: felix jirka karl
[69] http://www.w3.org/2012/11/27-mlw-lt-minutes.html
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Received on Tuesday, 27 November 2012 17:09:20 UTC