Re: Proposal to close ISSUE-19: Adressing more error cases, as is

On 06/10/2013 12:33 PM, Martynas Jusevičius wrote:
> Hey again,
>
>> On 06/10/2013 10:45 AM, Martynas Jusevičius wrote:
>>>
>>> Lets step back from the philosophical discussion a bit. By defining a
>>> media type per problem domain,
>>
>>
>> That is _not at all_ what was proposed. We would have to do it only
>> once, in the context of LDP. You're pretty much on your own with your
>> domain model from there. I hope you feel reassured with the approach
>> then :-)
>
> I haven't read 100% of the thread, but wasn't the proliferation of
> (RDF) media types one of the main issues?

No, this is not happening.

>
>>> you would break Linked Data for
>>> existing RDF software as it would not be able to recognise custom
>>> types.
>>
>>
>> That's a very interesting argument. Can you please say which softwares
>> would be broken? And why?
>>
>
> Any software that uses a mapping between media types and RDF syntaxes.
> Which syntax is it supposed to use to read
> application/api-problem+turtle or application/ldp+turtle
> representations? Or should it make that decision based on the
> "+turtle" token?

Right, +turtle would itself point to what's defined for turtle/text,
leaving the interactions and semantics to application/ldp (and
possibly application/api-problem).

>
> Here are examples from Jena's Fuseki and my Graphity code -- both use
> such mappings for content negotiation:
> http://grepcode.com/file/repo1.maven.org/maven2/org.apache.jena/jena-fuseki/0.2.4/org/apache/jena/fuseki/FusekiLib.java#FusekiLib.langFromContentType%28java.lang.String%29
> https://github.com/Graphity/graphity-browser/blob/master/src/main/java/org/graphity/client/util/DataManager.java

Would be extremely easy to adapt in the present case.

>
>>
>>> You would also prevent generic web application design, as a
>>> generic application cannot build on a vocabulary or type system that
>>> is uncontrolled.
>>
>>
>> That's again interesting. Can you please elaborate? For example, what
>> do you mean by "uncontrolled"?
>>
>
> With uncontrolled I mean that a mapping using uncontrolled types
> cannot be included in generic software, as it is not standardized and
> its full extent is unknown. There is a dozen RDF syntaxes, each with
> its own media type -- any software can easily have a mapping for that.
> If every service or API begins to offer its own media type, generic
> software can no longer maintain such mapping.

Ah, ok, so just know that there wouldn't be any new syntax.

Alexandre.

>
>>
>>> What it can use is a generic representation format,
>>> such as text/turtle.
>>
>>
>> Some of us has already tried to explain why text/turtle was not
>> enough, so I won't do it again :-)
>>
>> Alexandre.
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Martynas
>>> graphityhq.com
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 4:31 PM, Alexandre Bertails <bertails@w3.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On 06/04/2013 01:21 AM, Henry Story wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 3 Jun 2013, at 22:30, Kingsley Idehen <kidehen@openlinksw.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 6/3/13 3:31 PM, Erik Wilde wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> which would get to the touchy issue of media types.
>>>>>>> application/api-problem+json and application/api-problem+xml are the
>>>>>>> current
>>>>>>> media types, would an RDF model follow what pattern and expose
>>>>>>> application/api-problem+turtle?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, since API problems ultimately boil down to entity relationships.
>>>>>> The
>>>>>> format is ultimately irrelevant.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Agree with Kingsely. This issue is not touchy: it is settled.
>>>>>
>>>>> In RDF you don't need to create a media type for your responses,
>>>>> text/turtle will
>>>>> do.  The reason you have to do this with JSON is because, lacking
>>>>> namespaces you have no idea without the
>>>>> media type wha the content is.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I fail to understand where Erik's idea would be bad. The goal of the
>>>> spec is clear:
>>>>
>>>> [[
>>>> This document defines a "problem detail" as an extensible way to carry
>>>> machine-readable details of errors in a HTTP response, to avoid the
>>>> need to invent new response formats for HTTP APIs.
>>>> ]]
>>>>
>>>> application/api-problem already conveys the informations we'd want,
>>>> right? We would just have to register +turtle as a new Structured
>>>> Syntax Suffix and map the existing model to the RDF meta-model.
>>>>
>>>> That's the same discussion than with application/ldp+turtle...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> More useful would be to find which ontologies express the relevant
>>>>> information the user would need.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> What's already defined in application/api-problem is not enough? I
>>>> don't know, I haven't looked carefully, but I would start there
>>>> anyway.
>>>>
>>>> Alexandre.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Henry
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Social Web Architect
>>>>> http://bblfish.net/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>

Received on Monday, 10 June 2013 17:56:54 UTC