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Re: Action Item: http://www.w3.org/2006/04/19-i18nits-minutes.html#action01 (handling of inclusions)

From: Felix Sasaki <fsasaki@w3.org>
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2006 17:41:26 +0900
Message-ID: <444DE0B6.6060600@w3.org>
To: "Lieske, Christian" <christian.lieske@sap.com>
Cc: Yves Savourel <yves@opentag.com>, public-i18n-its@w3.org
Hi Christian,

It seems that it was clear to Sebastian, only unclear to Yves and me, so
how about adding just one sentence to your proposal:

<note>
The XPath expressions used by ITS selection assume that any
inclusions
(such as those based on XInclude) are resolved before selection is
applied. Accordingly, inclusion mechanisms such as XInclude or DITA's
<gi>conref</gi> may need to be followed before ITS selections are
applied. </note>

that is:
[[However, to avoid interoperability problems, the interpretation of
XPath expressions within the ITS selections MUST NOT require that
inclusion mechanisms are  processed.]]

- Felix

Lieske, Christian wrote:
> Yves, Felix,
> 
> I guess that indeed the wording I proposed was ambiguous. Thus, I will
> have to work on a modification ... Stay tuned.
> 
> Best regards,
> Christian 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: public-i18n-its-request@w3.org
> [mailto:public-i18n-its-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Felix Sasaki
> Sent: Montag, 24. April 2006 13:56
> To: Yves Savourel
> Cc: public-i18n-its@w3.org
> Subject: Re: Action Item:
> http://www.w3.org/2006/04/19-i18nits-minutes.html#action01 (handling of
> inclusions)
> 
> Hi Yves, all,
> 
> Yves Savourel wrote:
>> Hi Christian, Sebastian, all,
>>
>>> <note>
>>> The XPath expressions used by ITS selection assume that any
> inclusions 
>>> (such as those based on XInclude) are resolved before selection is 
>>> applied. Accordingly, inclusion mechanisms such as XInclude or DITA's
> 
>>> <gi>conref</gi> may need to be followed before ITS selections are 
>>> applied. </note>
>> Mmm... I thought we had reached the opposite conclusion (?)
> 
> I think so too. Maybe the wording is a little bit ambigous? Christian,
> Sebastian, do you agree with Yves interpretation?
> 
> At
> http://www.w3.org/International/its/itstagset/itstagset.html#def-selecto
> r
> , we have
> 
> [[Selection relies on the information which is given in the XML
> Information Set [XML Infoset]. ITS applications may implement inclusion
> mechanisms such as XInclude or DITA's [Dita 1.0] conref.]]
> 
> which I wrote during the f2f, having Yves interpretation in mind.
> 
> 
>> I thought we would have something more like: "The ITS selection
> mechanism applies to the PSVI of the document. It is assumed that
>> inclusion mechanisms such as XInclude of DITA's conref are not taken
> in account when ITS selections are applied."
>> In the current wording I see the "may need" but the "assume... are
> resolved before selection" seems to indicate that a processor
>> does not have really a choice, and that 'may need' is really a 'must'.
>>
>> It would be a bit un-realistic to ask all ITS processors (e.g. generic
> XML translation systems) to implement every inclusion
>> mechanism known (and the future ones...).
>>
>> Another solution, as Sebastian proposed during the face-to-face, would
> be to not say anything, or say ITS does not care: it's a tool
>> choice. But this would open the door for interoperability issues. We
> do not want that.
>> How other application handle inclusion? We can't compare ITS to CSS
> here because CSS is applied at the very end of the whole
>> process, while ITS is applied at the beginning. XSLT would ignore
> inclusions, wouldn't it?
> 
> Both XSLT and XQuery operate on a datamodel which is an extension of the
>  XML Infoset. These specs define what is in this data model, but not how
> it is constructed, see
> http://www.w3.org/TR/xquery/#id-data-model-generation :
> [[An XDM instance might also be synthesized directly from a relational
> database, or constructed in some other way (see DM3 in Fig. 1.) XQuery
> is defined in terms of the data model, but it does not place any
> constraints on how XDM instances are constructed.]]
> 
> So these specs do not say nothing, but say "you can do everything to
> create a data model instance, but it is your responsibility, and we
> don't care."
> 
> I don't know how to word that, though ...
> 
>> Cheers,
>> -yves
>>
>>
> 
> 
> 



Received on Tuesday, 25 April 2006 08:41:39 UTC

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