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Re: interface for providing public comments on last call working drafts

From: Leif Halvard Silli <xn--mlform-iua@xn--mlform-iua.no>
Date: Mon, 23 May 2011 19:09:41 +0200
To: Maciej Stachowiak <mjs@apple.com>
Cc: Steve Faulkner <faulkner.steve@gmail.com>, Sam Ruby <rubys@intertwingly.net>, HTMLWG WG <public-html@w3.org>, Paul Cotton <Paul.Cotton@microsoft.com>, Michael(tm) Smith <mike@w3.org>
Message-ID: <20110523190941221562.d47e70c5@xn--mlform-iua.no>
Maciej,

The draft themselves only allows to file a report. It doesn't allow you 
to search bugzilla. The most important thing, however, is follow-up of 
a bug report. This happens via e-mail: the one who filed a report gets 
a e-mail when the bug report is updated. The e-mail can also be found 
online, as an e-mail archive. And 'additional front end' to e-mail is 
not really thinkable.

But the key is, it seems, to improve the e-mail access. This was also 
one the issues that Gregory pointed out in the bug you closed.

In that regard, we know the following:

* Bugzilla can be configured to take e-mail input.
* The e-mail messages that Bugzilla sends out are not very
  accessible because they often contain visually oriented 
  tables presented as plain text.

Here are some routes to fix the problems:

1) open up Bugzilla's ability to take e-mail input - at least from 
members of W3. (This could, perhaps, be counted as "an additional front 
end".)
2) edit the e-mail templates of Bugzilla so they are more accessible
3) edit the online archived version of the bugs so that they are more 
accessible. For example, add ARIA and other stuff, and the bogus 
J-accesskey for jumping ot the body of the message, could be fixed - 
this would benefit all users, of all mailing lists:  
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-bugzilla  Last edit of 
the hypermail program that makes the online archives was in 2006, it 
seems: 
http://www.w3.org/2004/12/hypermail-w3c-patch/patch/w3c-0.50.patch

4) note that the online archives has a R accesskey which allows to 
answer the e-mail. So, if e-mail replies to bugzilla was permitted, 
this could be one route.
5) for message from public-html, there is an archived-at: URL header, 
which allows easy access to the online version, if that version for 
some reason is more accessible. However, for messages from bugzilla, 
there is no such archived-at: header (unless the message is also sent 
to another list than public-html-bugzilla - e.g. if a copy is sent to 
public-a11y@)


(PS: It would also be possible to update to a beta version of bugzilla 
whic sends out html mail - but this is probably too risky.)

Leif H Silli


Maciej Stachowiak, Mon, 23 May 2011 08:42:14 -0700:
> 
> In addition to what Sam mentioned, the drafts themselves have an 
> easy-to-use comment form in the status section.
> 
> If anyone wants to set up additional front ends to bugzilla that are 
> easier to use or more accessible, then I expect such work would be 
> welcome.
> 
> Regards,
> Maciej
> 
> On May 23, 2011, at 4:07 AM, Steve Faulkner wrote:
>> Hi sam, i read the decision policy bits, I have no issue with the 
>> decision policy
>> 
>> int the policy its states:
>> 
>> " Issues should be filed as bugs in W3C Bugzilla to be formally 
>> considered. If the commenter has difficulties filing a bug, one of 
>> the Chairs or a volunteer will assist them. "
>> 
>> So filing via bugzilla is not a requirement on the commenter, 
>> (presumably the requirement is on the chairs or vounteer assigned to 
>> ensure comments provided via the public comments mailing list get 
>> put into bugzilla)  All I am suggesting is that it would be the 
>> right thing to do to make the ability to post a bug to bugzilla for 
>> ANY user, rather than require people to identify themselves as 
>> unable to file a bug simply because the current bugzilla interface 
>> is poorly designed and inaccessible.
>> This would presumably result in less work for all.
>> 
>> regards
>> stevef
>> 
>> On 23 May 2011 11:43, Sam Ruby <rubys@intertwingly.net> wrote:
>>> On 05/23/2011 06:21 AM, Steve Faulkner wrote:
>>>> Hi all,
>>>> 
>>>> With the expected publication of a number of LC working drafts, I would
>>>> like to suggest that the interface for public comments be made user
>>>> friendly and accessible (bugzilla is neither of these things currently).
>>> 
>>> I encourage you to read the first two paragraphs of the Decision Policy:
>>> 
>>>  http://dev.w3.org/html5/decision-policy/decision-policy.html

>>> 
>>> If you have concrete suggestions for improvement, I suggest you 
>>> open a bug on the policy itself:
>>> 
>>>  http://tinyurl.com/6bpw9pq

>>> 
>>> - Sam Ruby
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> with regards
>> 
>> Steve Faulkner
>> Technical Director - TPG
>> 
>> www.paciellogroup.com | www.HTML5accessibility.com | 
>> www.twitter.com/stevefaulkner
>> HTML5: Techniques for providing useful text alternatives - 
>> dev.w3.org/html5/alt-techniques/
>> Web Accessibility Toolbar - 
>> www.paciellogroup.com/resources/wat-ie-about.html 
>> 
> '
Received on Monday, 23 May 2011 17:10:14 GMT

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