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Re: Renamed topic: focus and length of HTML5

From: Shelley Powers <shelley.just@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 10:41:39 -0600
Message-ID: <643cc0270912070841i5a4664feu51d3eb7cef311b6a@mail.gmail.com>
To: Geoffrey Sneddon <gsneddon@opera.com>
Cc: Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch>, Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>, public-html <public-html@w3.org>
On Mon, Dec 7, 2009 at 10:33 AM, Geoffrey Sneddon <gsneddon@opera.com> wrote:
> Shelley Powers wrote:
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 5, 2009 at 11:14 PM, Ian Hickson <ian@hixie.ch> wrote:
>>>
>>> On Sat, 5 Dec 2009, Shelley Powers wrote:
>>>>
>>>> More importantly, more editors ensures an essential comprehensiveness.
>>>
>>> Actually in my experience it's the other way around -- editors tend to
>>> silo themselves, leading to gaps between specs. For example, separating
>>> HTML4, DOM2 HTML, and XHTML1 led to huge gaps in the specs that we spent
>>> significant effort fixing in HTML5. Avoiding this has been one of the
>>> important features of work with Adam, Anne, Lachlan, and Larry (who have
>>> edited specifications spun out of HTML5), and it has not been easy. Ask
>>> Anne, for example, about handling the event loop mechanism. Ask Adam or
>>> Larry about ensuring that we keep a coherent interface between their
>>> specs
>>> and HTML5. It's easy to see how having more editors can quickly result in
>>> a _loss_ of comprehensiveness -- quite the opposite of ensuring it, as
>>> you
>>> assert above.
>>>
>>
>> Huge gaps?
>
> Find a normative requirement saying in what order should script elements be
> executed. This, as in the example below, makes a fairly large change to the
> semantics of the second, middle, script. What if I dynamically added these
> scripts to the DOM to create something that should be serialized like this,
> where is it defined when they should be executed?
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN">
> <script type="text/javascript">
> var a = 1;
> </script>
> <script type="text/javascript">
> alert(a);
> </script>
> <script type="text/javascript">
> var a = 2;
> </script>
>
> How should the following be specified? What part should go in an HTML spec
> and what part in a DOM spec?
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN">
> <script type="text/javascript">
> document.write("<b>");
> </script>
> foobar</b>
>
> What should the alert in the following? Again, where should the HTML and DOM
> parts of this be split?
>
> <!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01//EN">
> <iframe></iframe>
> <script type="text/javascript">
> var iframe = document.getElementsByTagName("iframe")[0];
> iframe.src = "http://example.com/";
> alert(iframe.getAttribute("src"));
> </script>
>
> Furthermore, if the HTML spec was entirely separate from DOM and defined in
> terms of a character stream, HTML and XHTML would need entirely different
> definitions (I'm also not sure how exactly you'd define the parser without
> it parsing to some sort of tree model).
>
> --
> Geoffrey Sneddon  Opera Software
> <http://gsnedders.com/>
> <http://www.opera.com/>
>

Is this a test? Do I get a gold star if I pass?

Could you rephrase your quiz questions into assertions about the gaps,
and how you feel they're best handled in HTML5, rather than another or
separate specification, and how the fact that this material has not
been included in HTML4 has adversely impacted on the development we
have today. That way we can have a discussion.

Thanks.

Shelley
Received on Monday, 7 December 2009 16:42:18 UTC

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