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Re: DRAFT: XForms Instance Data Module

From: Mark Birbeck <mark.birbeck@webbackplane.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2008 15:28:23 +0100
Message-ID: <ed77aa9f0807020728i16f2dbc3o1db2d5a2184a5d30@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Charles F Wiecha" <wiecha@us.ibm.com>
Cc: public-forms <public-forms@w3.org>

Hi Charlie,

No problem with that...happy to leave the non-XML stuff till later.

My main point was more to do with how much should go into this module,
and I was thinking that it would be quite handy to have a very basic
'data island' module, that was independent of the binding or events
module.

Regards,

Mark

On Wed, Jul 2, 2008 at 3:16 PM, Charles F Wiecha <wiecha@us.ibm.com> wrote:
> Hi Mark -- thanks very much for the comments.  I agree with the direction
> that our modules, particularly the data and model ones, should support a
> mix-and-match approach to their "content".
>
> What I've done in this first iteration is take the approach I think we
> adopted at the F2F which is to "do no innovation" over and above the
> existing 1.1 spec and just attempt the refactoring necessary to split it
> out into separate modules.
>
> We had a bunch of trouble in Amsterdam wrestling with what happens when we
> have non-XML data in the instance (our "IDL" discussions) so I've punted on
> all these issues for this initial cut.
>
> Let's discuss on the call whether we want to open this up again...or
> perhaps some experimentation in the ubiquity project could point the way as
> to how to do this...
>
> Thanks, Charlie
>
> Charles Wiecha
> Manager, Multichannel Web Interaction
> IBM T.J. Watson Research Center
> P.O. Box 704
> Yorktown Heights, N.Y.  10598
> Phone: (914) 784-6180, T/L 863-6180, Cell: (914) 320-2614
> wiecha@us.ibm.com
>
>
>
>
>
>        Re: DRAFT: XForms Instance Data Module
>
>
>        Mark Birbeck
>                    to:
>                      Charles F Wiecha
>                                                               07/01/08 06:05 PM
>
>
>
>
>        Cc:
>           public-forms
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Charlie,
>
> Great to see this moving forwards.
>
> My comments would be that this module probably does too much. I've
> always thought that at root we need a 'data island' module, which does
> nothing other than getting data from somewhere--or inline--and making
> it available to other layers of the architecture. (Some notes on this
> from a couple of years ago are here [1]. Note that in this discussion
> I also suggested that we allow text, not just full well-formed XML
> documents.)
>
> There are a couple of reasons for this. The first is of course that it
> is more modular, and makes it easier to co-ordinate; for example, we
> don't need events to define data islands, which we would if we
> included <setvalue> and <insert>.
>
> Second, it makes it possible to break the way that data is referenced
> from the data itself. For example, I wouldn't particularly want to see
> <insert> to be limited to XML, when we come to define that. And I'd
> like to see <bind> provide a 'view' on some underlying data that can
> be used in many ways.
>
> Regards,
>
> Mark
>
> [1] <http://www.formsplayer.com/node/50>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 1, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Charles F Wiecha <wiecha@us.ibm.com>
> wrote:
>> Dear Forms WG -- I'm not sure if this is on the agenda for tomorrow
>> (originally, we said we'd discuss binding last week and instance this
> week
>> but ... ) so am posting it now in case we do get to it.  It's still a
> rough
>> draft, particularly in that the examples continue to refer to elements
>> outside the scope of this module such as UI controls and bind elements.
> We
>> can discuss if this is on the right track or not...feedback would be
>> helpful.
>>
>> Thanks, Charlie
>>
>> (See attached file: index-all.html)
>>
>> Charles Wiecha
>> Manager, Multichannel Web Interaction
>> IBM T.J. Watson Research Center
>> P.O. Box 704
>> Yorktown Heights, N.Y.  10598
>> Phone: (914) 784-6180, T/L 863-6180, Cell: (914) 320-2614
>> wiecha@us.ibm.com
>
>
>
> --
> Mark Birbeck, webBackplane
>
> mark.birbeck@webBackplane.com
>
> http://webBackplane.com/mark-birbeck,
>
> webBackplane is a trading name of Backplane Ltd. (company number
> 05972288, registered office: 2nd Floor, 69/85 Tabernacle Street,
> London, EC2A 4RR)
>
>
>



-- 
Mark Birbeck, webBackplane

mark.birbeck@webBackplane.com

http://webBackplane.com/mark-birbeck

webBackplane is a trading name of Backplane Ltd. (company number
05972288, registered office: 2nd Floor, 69/85 Tabernacle Street,
London, EC2A 4RR)
Received on Wednesday, 2 July 2008 14:29:00 UTC

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