TAG telcon

25 oct 2004


See also: IRC log


TimBL, Chris, Norm, Noah, Stuart, DanC, Paul, Roy




<scribe> Scribe: Chris

<DanC> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2004Oct/att-0111/_tag.html OK by me as a record of 18 Oct telcon


Resolved: accept minutes of 18th October telcon

Tag summaries

PC: was not able to get them done, but AC chairs etc will be done later today
... rest of summary depends on what happens today

Dan: Does Steve know that it might be late?

Paul: Deadline is 28th

Staff content

Timbl: we don't have a spare, so Dan and Chris will share this task

<Norm> +1 to Dan and Chris for volunteering

Timbl: Working on tools like issue tracking that will help TAG and WGs alike

<DanC> 1Nov ok by me

Upcoming telcons

Stuart: Any regrets?

<DanC> Noah Note early regrets for 2 weeks out on Nov8.

people consult agendas and mutter

<DanC> PC at risk due to travel, but plans to attend 1 Nov

<Noah> Actually, let's make the probably regrets. Schema is meeting West Coast; I may be able to slip away for the call.

<DanC> oh yeah... I'd rather spend the 1 Nov slot on a director's decision call.

Stuart: volunteer for scribe?

Noah i will do it

TAG charter

Noah: I sent in comments, to the tag list

Stuart: coments are individual Members, not a TAG consensus.
... everyone okay with that

Dan: okay I guesss

Roy joins

Review of 2nd Last Call Document (30-45mins)

Norm: made a draft 19 Oct, produced another on 21st that included comments arising

Dan: Comments from Roy, before or after 21st draft?

<DanC> Subject: comments on NM mods: sec 2.4.1

<DanC> . Date: Mon, 18 Oct 2004 13:01:55 -0700

Norm: did best to incorporate these

Roy: additional comments after

<DanC> Subject: Re: CVS Notification of http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/webarch/webarch.html

<DanC> . Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:54:33 -0700

Norm: no recollection of that

Paul: Subject says CVS notification ...

<Stuart> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2004Oct/0075.html

Norm: can't find it. Oh well

<Zakim> DanC, you wanted to ask if Roy's most recent comments were before or after the 21Oct draft

Stuart: Decision to be made, move forward on 19th or 21st? The latter includes material fro Noah

Noah: Having read Roys comments, i sense we are converging

Chris: 19-October-2004 Editors Draft


21-October-2004 Editors Draft




timbl: have reviewed a little, not recently.

Stuart: what about the octet sequences?

timbl: not overly comfortable, changing lots of words for a smal change in the actual ontology

Noah: intention is to take it from an implied must to a strog should
... concerns over multiple streams
... concerns over future interaction protocol that has a typing mechanism other than internet media types

timbl: sorry, not checked if this upsets other things, prepared to trust others here

<DanC> (found it http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?type=1#uriMediaType-9 )

<Zakim> DanC, you wanted to suggest that it's still bits, no? the big change is whether Web resource types shall be Iana super/sub types for all time (hmm.... we have a relevant issue; do

Chris: like the wording about multiple streams, and desirability of a typing mechanism

Dan: big change to say we are not grounded i IANA media types for all time

<DanC> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/issues.html?type=1#uriMediaType-9

Dan: prefer to go with 21 draft, assuming we get agreement today. Would have preferred more discussion ideally but there we are

<Norm> ACTION: NW to add a pointer to uriMediaType-9 in the appropriate place

<DanC> (did norm hear my suggestion to cite issue 9 near http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/webarch/#def-representation ?)

Stuart: anyone want to speak in favor of the 19th draft

no one does

<Noah> Noah Thanks everyone for your careful attention to this rather large issue raised by a late-arriving TAG member.

PR planning

<DanC> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004lc/prreq.html $Revision: 1.32 $

Stuart: Dan sent a pointer to a draft PR request

Dan leads us through the text

Dan: traditionally this is also an agenda for the Director meeting

The changes since last call include a number of editorial modifications, plus:

* refined URI ownership (section 2.2.2) to be more clearly a relationship between identifiers and resources

* softened extensibility (section 4.2)

* clarified "information resource" (section 2.2)

* relaxed constraints on representations (sections 3.2, 2.2, etc.)

Dan: director might decide this is too many changes, or not

Norm; Dan and I looked over the cange logs and agree those four things are non editorial

Dan: In the first last cal, roenberg said some things we didn't really address

Thats a pretty broad definition; as it would include resources defined

by other URI schemes (such as sip and tel) which I don't think are

normally associated with the "web". The intent of the document, I think,

is to generally think about resources that correspond to content.

Chris: nice to tell tham that we agree or not

timbl: this is about inforesources or resources
... so prefer to say that we introduce IR to clarify the point that they make

chris: sip is an IR

Dan: its call setup

Roy: its another http-like

Timbl: clear that we have already covered this, just have not responded

Dan: concern that waiting for a response on that blows our schedule
... we issued a second LC so , as they did not respond to that, we assume they have n comments

<tagmem> Please change "tagmeme" to PaulC

timbl: a response from them would need a meeting of IAB

Chris: Happy to move on, if it does not affect W3C/IETF relations in a negative way'

Dan: moving on to formal objections

<DanC> " LMM wants us to review the URI guideline specs before finishing webarch."

<DanC> RF: there will be a 2nd editiong

<DanC> DC: yeah.

<PaulC> My only concern is that Larry M's issue re "ownership" is the same item that Karl continues to be concerned about.

Stuart: substantial interaction with QA is not relected in this document

TAG checks that approbation means An expression of warm approval; praise.

Dan: closed loop with karl, checked he was satisfied this morning

Paul: dodn't get that from his email

Dan: checked with him in IRC and he agreed
... discussion with kopecky about use of classes...

Stuart: willing to call hiom, know him fairly well

Noah: agree
... we cshould contact him formally to see if he wants to make a formal objection

Roy: responded to Myriams comment, its now closed

<DanC> closed. non-auth... http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webarch-comments/2004OctDec/0121.html

Dan: now two cases of clear outstanding dissent

"While we regret that we were unable to achieve consensus with these reviewers, we suggest that the document is sufficiently valuable to the community in its present state to merit advancement to Proposed Recommendation."

Dan: implementation experience - WGs changing specs - what else do we have

Stuart: VB on mime type override

<DanC> yes, SMIL WG should say Voice.

<DanC> CL: SVG did likewise

Chris: SVG added type attribute after seeing TAG discussions

<DanC> Stuart: WSDL on abstractComponentRef

and made it work as TAG suggests

Dan: not clear that is succesful impl. exp
... XMLP when to use get

<DanC> "4.5.6. XML ID semantics"

Paul; not clear that is specific to AWWW

Dan: points to AWW

Paul: OK

Dan: so is this convincing?

Chris: yes

Dan goes round the table

<PaulC> Advance to PR: Yes.

Noah: abstain, leaning to yes

Chris: Yes

Norm: Yes

Stuart: yes

Dan: yes

<timbl_> tim: would abstain from this vote on grounds multiple roles

Paul: yes

Roy: yes
... prefer to incorporate the other changes I sent

<Roy> I'd prefer to incorporate my changes to Norm's 21 Oct

timbl: Abstain

<DanC> PROPOSED: to request PR based on http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004lc/prreq.html http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004/webarch-20041021/ subject to changes agreed by RF, NM, NDW.

<DanC> PROPOSED: to request PR based on http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004lc/prreq.html http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004/webarch-20041021/ subject to changes agreed by RF, NM, NDW re generalized representation

Noah: what do we fall back to?

Chris: agreed on 21st already

Stuart: puts the question

timbl: abstain

all others: aye

Stuart: woo hoo

Resolved: to request PR based on http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004lc/prreq.html http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004/webarch-20041021/ subject to changes agreed by RF, NM, NDW re generalized representation

Norm: deals with practicalities of agreeing on text by phone, by cob tomorrow
... draft by cob tomorrow, wil lbug you after cob wednesday

Stuart: so we expect a directors meeting next week

discussion o who needs to attend and why

timbl steps out to talk to Steve

scribe: but fails to find him

Dan: prefers to have Norm there
... you may pick up action items

Stuart: ok, as far as we can thre. rest of plan to PR...

<Stuart> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004/10/05-07-tag.html#plan234

rest of plan to PR

<DanC> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004/10/05-07-tag#plan234

Dan reviews http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004/10/05-07-tag.html#plan234 and notes we are on track so far

>>>06 Dec: English first draft of press release to Comm team

>>>08 Dec: Testimonials due

>>>08 Dec: English draft of Press Release done

>>>13 Dec: Translations of Press Release done

Chris: discusses possibility of chair testimonials

Dan: who writes first draft?

Chris: i do

tech plenary

Stuart: we skipped over this
... Dan suggests observers on same basis as last years

Dan: who chairs the half day meeting?

Stuart: i could do that

Dan: so you get to decide about observers

Stuart: which liaisons?

QA, XML Core,

<Paulc> It is likely that XML Schema WG will meet thu-fri.

Chris: liais with foks expected to figure largely in AWWW 2

Paul; Schema will likely meet thurs and fri

<Zakim> Noah, you wanted to remind that I've suggest early contact with David Ezell on schemas and versioning

Noah: Contact chair of Schema WG to coordinate this

Stuart: is this ex/vers special eeting - ie larger than just tag ad schema?

<DanC> yeah, I can see it both ways too.

Noah: focus was on versioning - can see this both ways.

<DanC> "RESOLVED: to meet 1/2 day on 28 Feb 2005 in Boston, MA, USA, and for TAG members to participate on a best-effort basis in liaison meetings throughout the week of the W3C Technical Plenary." -- http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004/10/05-07-tag

Noah: whe are we goin to meet?

Stuart: think we prefer first half of the week

<Zakim> DanC, you wanted to request TAG/ws-addressing contact ASAP

Dan: WS-addressing and TAG. Recently chartered, charter notes a possible cnflict in early specs re use URIs

Stuart: Happy to give Mark Nottingham a call and see if we would like to meet

<scribe> ACTION: Stuart cal mark Nottingham about a meeting

Stuart: d a heados-up to chairs?

Dan: sure, might get a lot of mail

Chris: yes

Stuart: propose an early adjourn

Paul: Norm, what is the plan for revision to extensibility and versioning

<DanC> (oops; we dropped an action...)

<DanC> "ACTION NDW: to report workplan and dates for Extensibilty and Versioning work." -- http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2004/10/05-07-tag

Norm: doing well but not this week. Next week is likely for Dave and I

Paul: so its likely t be ready after we request PR

<DanC> (hmm... actions related to issues might have sorta fallen by the wayside)

Chris: reports progress on xml:id

Stuart: adjourn!

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: NW to add a pointer to uriMediaType-9 in the
... appropriate place
[NEW] ACTION: Stuart cal mark Nottingham about a meeting

Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl 1.94 (CVS log)
$Date: 2004/10/22 18:32:00 $