[![W3C][1]][2] # Device APIs Working Group Teleconference ## 07 Aug 2014 [Agenda][3] See also: [IRC log][4] ## Attendees Present Anssi_Kostiainen, Cathy_Chan, Frederick_Hirsch, Giri_Mandyam, Lisa_DeLuca, Mats_Wichmann Regrets Chair Frederick_Hirsch Scribe fjh ## Contents * [Topics][5] 1. [Welcome, agenda review, scribe selection, announcements][6] 2. [Minutes approval][7] 3. [Last Call conclusion and CR publication of HTML Media Capture, Light, Vibration][8] 4. [Vibration Test updates][9] 5. [Charter Update][10] 6. [Battery - Cordova Feedback][11] 7. [Open Battery Issues][12] 8. [Action Review][13] 9. [Cordova next steps][14] 10. [Other Business][15] 11. [Adjourn][16] * [Summary of Action Items][17] * * * Date: 07 August 2014 ### Welcome, agenda review, scribe selection, announcements ScribeNick: fjh Media Capture TF update on list (2 July): [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public /public-device-apis/2014Jul/0017.html][18] TPAC (27-31 Oct, Santa Clara) Registration now open, [http://www.w3.org/2014/11/TPAC/][19] ### Minutes approval Approve minutes from 26 June 2014 [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jun/att-0116/minutes-2014-06-26.html][20] **RESOLUTION: Minutes from 26 June 2014 are approved** ### Last Call conclusion and CR publication of HTML Media Capture, Light, Vibration Last Call drafts of HTML Media Capture, Light, Vibration published, LC ended 24 July 2014 No last call comments on HTML Media Capture. No last call comments on Light Events. One Last Call Comment on Vibration API, see [https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc- comments-tracker/43696/WD-vibration-20140619/2945][21] Proposed resolution: [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Aug/0000.html][22] Proposed RESOLUTION: Adopt proposed resolution for LC-2945, [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2014Aug/0000.html][22] **RESOLUTION: Adopt proposed resolution for LC-2945, [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Aug/0000.html][22]** **ACTION:** anssik to add resolution to LC-2945 to draft [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action01][23]] Created ACTION-706 - Add resolution to lc-2945 to draft [on Anssi Kostiainen - due 2014-08-14]. anssik: should it be a note fjh: normative is better anssi: assume you are aligning the implementation with W3C LisaDeLuca_IBM: updated javascript bridge so shoud affect all across platform ... should be good for all releases should go into Cordova 3.6, next month ... which should we tackle next fjh: also welcome feedback on battery (later in today's agenda) ... Plan and changes for CR publications: [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public /public-device-apis/2014Aug/0001.html][24] **RESOLUTION: Start 2 week CfC ending 21 August to publish CR drafts of HTML Media Capture, Ambient Light Events, and the Vibration API on 28 August, with details as noted in [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Aug/0001.html][24]** **ACTION:** fjh to send CfC for CR for HTML Media Capture, Ambient Light Events, Vibration API [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap- minutes.html#action02][25]] Created ACTION-707 - Send cfc for cr for html media capture, ambient light events, vibration api [on Frederick Hirsch - due 2014-08-14]. fjh: suggest we stay with old process for now [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2014Aug/0012.html][26] ### Vibration Test updates [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2014Jul/0052.html][27] some vibration tests are still missing [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2014Jul/0054.html][28] anssik: I think we agreed he can write tests even though test facilitator as long as we get review, so I can ask him to write tests for those that are missing fjh: yes, that is right ... please ask him to do this anssik: only three missing, one no longer relevant ... I can review the tests **ACTION:** anssik to ask zhiqiang to complete vibration tests [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action03][29]] Created ACTION-708 - to ask zhiqiang to complete vibration tests [on Anssi Kostiainen - due 2014-08-14]. anssik: firefox bug fixed as part of this test fjh: yes, that was good [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0052.html][27] ### Charter Update fjh: I think we need Dom for this discussion proposed Wake Lock addition: [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public- device-apis/2014Jul/0055.html][30] WebIntents, [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0023.html][31] (Paul Kinlan) fjh: not sure what we can do now on this call, please review anssik: webintents removed from WebApps charter in latest update ... what does this mean with respect to the Task Force fjh: if it is not in the WebApps charter then I do not believe it makes sense to continue a joint task force, since there could be associated IPR obligations ... that said, I think we can keep the Task Force list and have a Task force for the DAP WG if useful ... we should involve Dom in discussions, he understands bigger chartering picture ... across the groups ... we already have WebIntents work in the DAP charter, given the interest probably makes sense to keep, maybe with some modifications ... presumable we will review a draft charter before formally progressing to recharter ... lets defer discussion until we have Dom on the call with more facts ### Battery - Cordova Feedback LisaDeLuca_IBM: we have some concern about battery, here is link [http://apache.markmail.org/search/?q=org.apache.incubator .callback-dev+list%3Aorg.apache.incubator.callback-dev+order%3Adate- backward+w3c#query:org.apache.incubator.callback- dev%20list%3Aorg.apache.incubator.callback-dev%20order%3Adate- backward%20w3c+page:1+mid:3qrirxhvzumzkyh2+state:results][32] LisaDeLuca_IBM: we have some concern about battery, here is link "The spec is flawed in that there's no way we could implement it as it stands. The spec needs to be reworked to be more event driven and asynchronous. Right now it's too much like device with everything up front." LisaDeLuca_IBM: will follow up fjh: a concrete proposal would be helpful anssi: not sure what this means to be "more event driven" ... we already have events in the spec ... too high level comment, need concrete feedback LisaDeLuca_IBM: yes, will ask fjh: this is the only remaining Cordova issue/feedback, correct? LisaDeLuca_IBM: yes fjh: will raise issue on this one to track it ### Open Battery Issues review issues and status noted in [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public- device-apis/2014Aug/0006.html][33] ISSUE-164? ISSUE-164 -- Correct default for charging time if unknown in battery -- open [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/164][34] fjh: can we close anssik: ok cathy: ok close ISSUE-164 Closed ISSUE-164. ISSUE-165? ISSUE-165 -- Clarify language around multiple batteries -- open [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/165][35] fjh: can we close anssik: yes cathy: yes close ISSUE-165 Closed ISSUE-165. ISSUE-166? ISSUE-166 -- Should getBattery() always return the same promise? -- open [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/166][36] mounir's answer [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0006.html][37] fjh: we are treating as one virtual battery, so why would you ever have more than one battery manager? ... this should stay open, no resolution anssik: spec has not been updated ... I will check and respond to mounir on the list ... to follow upon on ISSUE-166 and [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public /public-device-apis/2014Jul/0003.html][38] **ACTION:** anssik to follow upon on ISSUE-166 and [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2014Jul/0003.html][38] [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action04][39]] Created ACTION-709 - Follow upon on issue-166 and [http://lists.w3.org/archives/public/public-device-apis/2014jul/0003.html][40] [on Anssi Kostiainen - due 2014-08-14]. fjh: we need a concrete proposal so we can be clear on what we agree to. One Promise, one BatteryManager? anssik: no argument that BatteryManager should be same instance fjh: why does it matter whether promise is same or not? anssi: comparision? ... this may be a minor issue ISSUE-167? ISSUE-167 -- Should Promises be used in Battery API -- open [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/167][41] fjh: we were accomodating the feedback to use promises uniformly, but maybe that was a mistake anssik: need opportunity to prompt user before getting battery - advantage of promises ... but slight advantage of having data avaialble syncnronouslly ... first access to battery manager slower than subsequent times [https://twitter.com/ebidel/status/494963550683533312][42] fjh: I thought advantage was usability for code writing, given potential complexity of nested call backs anssik: true but not used that way in this API so not relevant, since only giving battery manager handler instance, not for the events ... not used here as they are primarily designed ... google concern is performance fjh: what about web components? [https://gist.github.com/ebidel/d9c591d77b4c2b68c347][43] anssi: have an implementation for old implementation and for the new fjh: do we have measurements for the old implementation? [https://gist.github.com/rwaldron/850590359d298e35bc61][44] fjh: look there is long startup time on old design as well as new for desktop ... something like object instantiation ... not sure it makes sense for us to analyzie in real time anssik: should we publish fjh: think we need to look at some of the bigger issues first ISSUE-168? ISSUE-168 -- getBattery() vs. requestBattery() pattern -- open [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/168][45] anssik: I can summarize issues on the list fjh: first api was simpler so why not use that? what is the real problem at issue? anssik: multiprocess but we've heard both ways ... will send summary to list of technical issues and key points I can try to summarize on the list what I gather as pros and cons for both the designs fjh: will suggest going back to original design, ask why not, simplest anssik: issue of dealing with conflicting implementations, google shipping behind run time flag in canary fjh: ok so lets take this to the list [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/168][45] fjh: anssi, I think you need to look at this offline and talk to mounir **ACTION:** anssik to look at ISSUE-168 [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/168][45] [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action05][46]] Created ACTION-710 - Look at issue-168 [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/168][45] [on Anssi Kostiainen - due 2014-08-14]. ### Action Review ACTION-704? ACTION-704 -- Lisa Seacat DeLuca to Follow up re closing january cordova feedback -- due 2014-07-03 -- OPEN [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/704][47] close ACTION-704 Closed ACTION-704. ACTION-705? ACTION-705 -- Anssi Kostiainen to Add warning to Battery API that (naive) implementation of API could negatively affect battery life -- due 2014-08-11 -- OPEN [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/705][48] fjh: can defer, will leave open for now, will probably be resolved with other fixes close ACTION-700 Closed ACTION-700. close ACTION-702 Closed ACTION-702. ### Cordova next steps fjh: think you might want to consider HTML Media Capture or Light Events, since stable and moving forward LisaDeLuca_IBM: HTML Media Capture would make sense, stable, don't have anything for Light [http://plugins.cordova.io/#/package/org.awokenwell.proximity][49] anssik: might be different than plugins ... might be a challenge LisaDeLuca_IBM: can look at it, will send a message to the list about any difficulties fjh: good to get an idea, can then decide what to do next ### Other Business fjh: Anssik can you please talk to mounir, let's see if we can understand the core issues, get concrete proposals for battery ... what can we simplify ... next call scheduled for 21 August expect we will discuss the charter if Dom is back ### Adjourn ## Summary of Action Items **[NEW]** **ACTION:** anssik to ask zhiqiang to complete vibration tests [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action03][29]] **[NEW]** **ACTION:** anssik to add resolution to LC-2945 to draft [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action01][23]] **[NEW]** **ACTION:** anssik to follow upon on ISSUE-166 and [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2014Jul/0003.html][38] [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action04][39]] **[NEW]** **ACTION:** anssik to look at ISSUE-168 [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/168][45] [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action05][46]] **[NEW]** **ACTION:** fjh to send CfC for CR for HTML Media Capture, Ambient Light Events, Vibration API [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap- minutes.html#action02][25]] [End of minutes] * * * Minutes formatted by David Booth's [scribe.perl][50] version 1.135 ([CVS log][51]) $Date: 2009-03-02 03:52:20 $ [1]: http://www.w3.org/Icons/w3c_home [2]: http://www.w3.org/ [3]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Aug/0007.html [4]: http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-irc [5]: #agenda [6]: #item01 [7]: #item02 [8]: #item03 [9]: #item04 [10]: #item05 [11]: #item06 [12]: #item07 [13]: #item08 [14]: #item09 [15]: #item10 [16]: #item11 [17]: #ActionSummary [18]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0017.html [19]: http://www.w3.org/2014/11/TPAC/ [20]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jun/att-0116/minutes-2014-06-26.html [21]: https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/43696/WD- vibration-20140619/2945 [22]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Aug/0000.html [23]: http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action01 [24]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Aug/0001.html [25]: http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action02 [26]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Aug/0012.html [27]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0052.html [28]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0054.html [29]: http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action03 [30]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0055.html [31]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0023.html [32]: http://apache.markmail.org/search/?q=org.apache.incubator.callback- dev+list%3Aorg.apache.incubator.callback-dev+order%3Adate- backward+w3c#query:org.apache.incubator.callback- dev%20list%3Aorg.apache.incubator.callback-dev%20order%3Adate- backward%20w3c+page:1+mid:3qrirxhvzumzkyh2+state:results [33]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Aug/0006.html [34]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/164 [35]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/165 [36]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/166 [37]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0006.html [38]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2014Jul/0003.html [39]: http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action04 [40]: http://lists.w3.org/archives/public/public-device- apis/2014jul/0003.html [41]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/167 [42]: https://twitter.com/ebidel/status/494963550683533312 [43]: https://gist.github.com/ebidel/d9c591d77b4c2b68c347 [44]: https://gist.github.com/rwaldron/850590359d298e35bc61 [45]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/168 [46]: http://www.w3.org/2014/08/07-dap-minutes.html#action05 [47]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/704 [48]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/705 [49]: http://plugins.cordova.io/#/package/org.awokenwell.proximity [50]: http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm [51]: http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/