# Device APIs and Policy Working Group Teleconference ## 09 Mar 2011 [Agenda][3] See also: [IRC log][4] ## Attendees Present Claes_Nilsson, Frederick_Hirsch, Gyubong_Oh, John_Morris, Laszlo_Gombos, Niklas_Widell, Rich_Tibbett, Robin_Berjon, bryan_sullivan Regrets Thomas_Roessler Chair Robin_Berjon, Frederick_Hirsch Scribe nwidell ## Contents * [Topics][5] 1. [Administrative][6] 2. [Minutes approval][7] 3. [F2F Agenda][8] 4. [Workshop][9] 5. [June/July F2F][10] 6. [Charter][11] 7. [APIs][12] 8. [Contacts][13] 9. [Sys Info][14] 10. [Messaging][15] 11. [Outstanding actions][16] 12. [Adjourn][17] * [Summary of Action Items][18] * * * Date: 09 March 2011 trackbot-ng, start telecon Meeting: Device APIs and Policy Working Group Teleconference Date: 09 March 2011 scribeNick: nwidell ### Administrative Daylight savings time start [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-device- apis/2011Mar/0001.html][19] W3C Workshop on Web Tracking and User Privacy [http://www.w3.org/2011/track-privacy/][20] 2nd Last Call Working Draft Transition announcement of the Ontology for Media Resource 1.0 [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0028.html][21] Robin already commented on previous draft darobin some relationship with our work, may want to revisit API at later point Content security policy [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0014.html][22] dom: it is an interesting proposal, but fairly different scope compared to DAP dom notes security mechanism related to http headers, but different scope from dap, focus on cross-site scripting Universal control API [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0021.html][23] fjh: not quite sure what to do with proposal, richt: it would beneficial to have other players in DAP, nice to bring work in nice to bring other industries in to a well-balanced discussion forum. darobin: They are interested, some quite interesting security issues, we should reach out to BBC about this, should take it into chartering discussion Overview of W3C technologies for mobile Web applications [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Feb/0108.html][24] F2F is next week, no teleconference call, and no call following week. ### Minutes approval Approve 23 February minutes [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Feb/att-0105/minutes-2011-02-23.html][25] I am not famillar with IRC. probably, yes, I am **RESOLUTION: Minutes from 23 February 2011 approved** ### F2F Agenda Draft agenda: [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/wiki/F2F_Agenda_15][26],_16,_18_March_2011,_Seoul darobin: Starting time (0900) ok? fjh: good to have early start for people calling in. [http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingtime.html?day=9&month=3&ye ar=2011&p1=235&p2=195&p3=43&p4=137][27] richt, if you could send your input re ACTION-343 before the F2F, it would be best for the charter discussions I will provide that on the list (5pm Seoul is 8am London, FWIW) [http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingtime.html?day=15&month=3&year= 2011&p1=235&p2=195&p3=43&p4=137&iv=0][28] is a better link given daylight change in US on Sunday yeah, dialling in from Europe is going to hurt. fyi, 9am in Korea is midnight in London fjh: might switch contacts and interop. richt: what about device? ACTION-300? ACTION-300 -- Claes Nilsson to start working on use cases and requirements for video/audio conference à la element -- due 2010-11-12 -- OPEN [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/300][29] fjh: please send comments on Agenda to public list Logistics information: [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/wiki/SeoulF2F2011][30] zakim reservation, [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-device- apis/2011Mar/0000.html][31] ### Workshop [http://www.w3c.or.kr/DAP2011/][32] RE: F2F. I'm concerned on the timings for dialling in from Europe but not much we can do on that. Will see how it goes. fjh: DAP members do not need to register for workshop, others do [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0006.html][33] ### June/July F2F ### Charter Current charter, [http://www.w3.org/2009/05/DeviceAPICharter.html][34] Proposed charter, [http://www.w3.org/2010/11/DeviceAPICharter.html][35] Call out Sensor Specification separately from SysInfo (Dzung) Additional deliverables, Privacy Mechanisms, Feature Permissions [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0016.html][36] Audio volume API, [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0023.html][37] fjh: Suggest to add sensor deliverable ... Feature permission should certainly be a group deliverable ... we need to mention a Privacy deliverable in the charter +1 dom: The more concrete proposal we have the easier it is to discuss it fjh: not sure how detailed how the text wrt privacy can be at this point dom: Need to define at least rough scope. **ACTION:** fjh to propose concrete text for privacy and feature permission for draft charter [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap- minutes.html#action01][38]] Created ACTION-344 - Propose concrete text for privacy and feature permission for draft charter [on Frederick Hirsch - due 2011-03-16]. ACTION-343? ACTION-343 -- Richard Tibbett to propose better wording for System information and events api in new charter -- due 2011-03-02 -- OPEN [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/343][39] fjh: Sensors are also wide reaching, need to define scope, AR might be based on sensor work ### APIs [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0015.html][40] [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2011Mar/att-0001 /microsoft-api-draft-final.html#capture_api_extensions][41] darobin: Microsoft provided some good indirect feedback on the Media Capture API ... includes some usage examples, and how to be used in code richt, you wanted to ask if we should direct them to the element instead of overloading the file input control (like we tried and failed to do). richt: Two proposals (capture/device), streaming more related to device, should we point them there darobin: It is Microsoft's input to the incubator group richt: The concept of speech apis is very important ... we should try to avoid fragmentation darobin: Microsoft's document was definitely feedback to DAP note that we don't have any of the editors of the document on the call, unfortunately **ACTION:** Laszlo to look at Microsoft feedback on Capture API [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action02][42]] Created ACTION-345 - Look at Microsoft feedback on Capture API [on Laszlo Gombos - due 2011-03-16]. ACTION-345: [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www- archive/2011Mar/att-0001/microsoft-api-draft- final.html#capture_api_extensions][41] ACTION-345 Look at Microsoft feedback on Capture API notes added Laszlo: I can be an editor of Media Capture ### Contacts Updates to the Contacts API (cvs_log) [http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2009/dap/contacts/Overview.html][43] darobin: Two topics, updates and search filters richt: Updated spec in line with previous discussions on calls, list ... feedback would be great. darobin: Should try to have feedback before F2F ISSUE-106? ISSUE-106 -- Does Contacts API having a timezone field make sense, should it be utfOffset or utcOffset and tz to better match vCard? -- open [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/106][44] dom, you wanted to ask about LC dom: Is the Time Zone issue solved? [re search Filter, I think we should be much more silent since search filters are meant as hints rather than as strict filters] should add comment to issue noting how it is resolved when closing it richt: the current spec contains informative info about time zone, but it is a dual-purpose attibute, fjh: Why remove search filters? richt: filters don't add value to API, only to UI. The complexity of the search filter outweigh benefits (I would actually favor not defining an algorithm for filtering, but not removing filters completely) +1 to dom richt: search filters are hard, we can put it back later +1 dom: intent to keep the filter parameter for UA use, but scrap filtering algorithm +1 to retaining feature, not sure how well defined it has to be richt: scrap filtering algorithm might work are the user interaction guidelines is entirely optional, should it be? dom: We often provide hooks for UAs, but not ull functionality s/Is the user interrface/are the user interaction guidelines/ darobin: One advantage of having search filter present, then in trusted environments searches can be made more efficiently RESOLUTION: Keep the search filter parameter, but simplify the feature fjh, you wanted to ask about what happends to 4.2 darobin, you wanted to talk about CfC darobin: Wait with CfC until updates made ### Sys Info darobin: Fold the current discussion into charter discussion? dom: better to keep progress on current work darobin: Proposals? ... might want to split work into safe/simple parts and complex/extensible parts +1 for people coming up with concrete proposals fjh: wasn't idea to keep sysinfo, but pull out sensors to separate generic FW api dom: we need concrete proposals +1 [let's do battery] richt: If we expose only a tiny amount of device information we have actually succeeded +1 to start with simple and do it well :) section 4 of sysinfo outlines various aspects that could be treated separately **ACTION:** Robin to propose a sweet and simple battery API [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action03][45]] Created ACTION-346 - Propose a sweet and simple battery API [on Robin Berjon - due 2011-03-16]. Laszlo: look at availability of sys info in android may be a good starting point **ACTION:** Laszlo to come up with some examples and rough ideas for simple sysinfo APIs at the f2f [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap- minutes.html#action04][46]] Created ACTION-347 - Come up with some examples and rough ideas for simple sysinfo APIs at the f2f [on Laszlo Gombos - due 2011-03-16]. ### Messaging darobin: Use Messaging based on URI schemes richt: My proposal was to expose messagin though libraries, URI schemes client/server interaction etc, no specific API ... it is an API that does not need to be an API ... not convinced by the existing additions (callbacks, attachments) darobin: But Apple's Messaging API (simple) dom: Can't discuss it ... relying on client server will not work with SMS/MMS richt: is there enough incentive with callbacks/attachments to have separate API darobin: can we create dead simple API (e.g. only adding attachments)? [the hidden problem no one has raised is how the heck the browser gets to know the user's email configuration...] richt: extend URIs with extra parameters for attachments [darobin, you wouldn't need it with our current API]
dom: doing attachments through URI schemes is unlikely [dom, how are you going to send something as robin@berjon.com without knowing my server's password? use open relays?] [through my MUA] navigator.sendMessage("mailto:foo@bar.com", [blob1, blob2, blob3], errorCB) right [dom, right, but I'm not sure how to communicate attachments to my MUA] [well, using your local IPC system, I would assume] richt: Implementor support is very important dom: but the problem has been to get that implementor feedback [we want a more fleshed out proposal, then get feedback] dom: we probably have a start to a new proposal +1 dom: should aim for something more "webby" **ACTION:** Dom to send concrete proposal for navigator.sendMessage with URI scheme [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap- minutes.html#action05][47]] Created ACTION-348 - Send concrete proposal for navigator.sendMessage with URI scheme [on Dominique Hazaël-Massieux - due 2011-03-16]. ### Outstanding actions ACTION-341? ACTION-341 -- Dominique Hazaël-Massieux to reserve zakim line for f2f -- due 2011-03-09 -- PENDINGREVIEW [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/341][48] ACTION-322? ACTION-322 -- Frederick Hirsch to follow up on ECMA TC-39 coordination -- due 2011-01-20 -- PENDINGREVIEW [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/322][49] ACTION-335? ACTION-335 -- Frederick Hirsch to propose charter changes related to security and privacy deliverables -- due 2011-02-23 -- PENDINGREVIEW [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/335][50] ISSUE-81? ISSUE-81 -- How to represent dates? ES has Date but with no TZ information; using strings is less than ideal; do we have to create a Web Dates specification? -- open [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/81][51] ACTION-297? ACTION-297 -- Robin Berjon to draft up TZDate -- due 2010-11-11 -- OPEN [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/297][52] richt: Would be great if javascript had a Calendar object (timezonedate) similar to Java Calendar class Please review the open actions list, note any actions that should be closed and try to complete actions, preferably before the F2F if feasible open action list, [http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/open][53] ### Adjourn ## Summary of Action Items **[NEW]** **ACTION:** Dom to send concrete proposal for navigator.sendMessage with URI scheme [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap- minutes.html#action05][47]] **[NEW]** **ACTION:** fjh to propose concrete text for privacy and feature permission for draft charter [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap- minutes.html#action01][38]] **[NEW]** **ACTION:** Laszlo to come up with some examples and rough ideas for simple sysinfo APIs at the f2f [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap- minutes.html#action04][46]] **[NEW]** **ACTION:** Laszlo to look at Microsoft feedback on Capture API [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action02][42]] **[NEW]** **ACTION:** Robin to propose a sweet and simple battery API [recorded in [http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action03][45]] [End of minutes] * * * Minutes formatted by David Booth's [scribe.perl][54] version 1.135 ([CVS log][55]) $Date: 2009-03-02 03:52:20 $ [1]: http://www.w3.org/Icons/w3c_home [2]: http://www.w3.org/ [3]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0027.html [4]: http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-irc [5]: #agenda [6]: #item01 [7]: #item02 [8]: #item03 [9]: #item04 [10]: #item05 [11]: #item06 [12]: #item07 [13]: #item08 [14]: #item09 [15]: #item10 [16]: #item11 [17]: #item12 [18]: #ActionSummary [19]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-device- apis/2011Mar/0001.html [20]: http://www.w3.org/2011/track-privacy/ [21]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0028.html [22]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0014.html [23]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0021.html [24]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Feb/0108.html [25]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Feb/att-0105/minutes-2011-02-23.html [26]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/wiki/F2F_Agenda_15 [27]: http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingtime.html?day=9&month=3&year =2011&p1=235&p2=195&p3=43&p4=137 [28]: http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingtime.html?day=15&month=3&yea r=2011&p1=235&p2=195&p3=43&p4=137&iv=0 [29]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/300 [30]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/wiki/SeoulF2F2011 [31]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-device- apis/2011Mar/0000.html [32]: http://www.w3c.or.kr/DAP2011/ [33]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0006.html [34]: http://www.w3.org/2009/05/DeviceAPICharter.html [35]: http://www.w3.org/2010/11/DeviceAPICharter.html [36]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0016.html [37]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0023.html [38]: http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action01 [39]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/343 [40]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device- apis/2011Mar/0015.html [41]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2011Mar/att-0001 /microsoft-api-draft-final.html#capture_api_extensions [42]: http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action02 [43]: http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2009/dap/contacts/Overview.html [44]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/106 [45]: http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action03 [46]: http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action04 [47]: http://www.w3.org/2011/03/09-dap-minutes.html#action05 [48]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/341 [49]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/322 [50]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/335 [51]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/81 [52]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/297 [53]: http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/open [54]: http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm [55]: http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/