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Minutes, Thu 11 Feb, 2010, SVG WG telcon

From: Erik Dahlstrom <ed@opera.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Feb 2010 22:35:05 +0100
To: "public-svg-wg@w3.org" <public-svg-wg@w3.org>
Message-ID: <op.u7zfkrlggeuyw5@printer.xn--dahlstrm-doa36b.net>
Minutes here:

   http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html

or as text below:


    [1]W3C

       [1] http://www.w3.org/

                                - DRAFT -

                    SVG Working Group Teleconference

11 Feb 2010

    See also: [2]IRC log

       [2] http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-irc

Attendees

    Present
    Regrets
    Chair
           ed

    Scribe
           ed

Contents

      * [3]Topics
          1. [4]webfonts
          2. [5]markerPaint
          3. [6]css scientific notation
          4. [7]FX taskforce
          5. [8]widgets
          6. [9]gradients
      * [10]Summary of Action Items
      _________________________________________________________

    <trackbot> Date: 11 February 2010

    <ChrisL>
    [11]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-ac-members/2010JanMar/00
    25.html

      [11]  
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/w3c-ac-members/2010JanMar/0025.html

    <scribe> scribe: ed

webfonts

    <ChrisL> [12]http://www.w3.org/2009/08/WebFonts/activity-proposal
    (member onlt)

      [12] http://www.w3.org/2009/08/WebFonts/activity-proposal

    CL: explains what happened, for the process document
    ... looking at implementation, there are cmdline tools for woff
    ... and he coded into firefox
    ... firefox 3.6 shipped with woff support
    ... requested fontforge to add woff support
    ... it's already in their cvs, and works
    ... there are some python tools for validation
    ... and it can write @fontface rules for you
    ... apple hasn't stated a position
    ... opera has said they will support it
    ... microsoft was saying they wanted CWT instead
    ... used to be called EOT-light
    ... someone had trademark on that

    <jwatt> Zakim: +[I is me

    <jwatt> Zakim: [IP is me

    <jwatt> Zakim: [IPCaller] is me

    <jwatt> Zakim: IPCaller is me

    CL: we've got two deliverables, the woff spec, and a conformance
    spec
    ... you must support css, same origin restriction, will depend on
    css3 fonts spec
    ... you need a font and a stylesheet to make it work
    ... the font group will produce tests
    ... tell your ac reps to vote on this
    ... svg 1.1 and 1.2T mandates svg font format
    ... i'd like svg 2 to mandate woff
    ... but should it require svgfonts?

    DS: i'm torn
    ... thanks to CL for pulling WOFF together
    ... i'm torn about svgfonts personally
    ... making it a must means that it's harder to have ppl hit the svg
    target
    ... i'd like to say svg 2.0 is 100% implemented soon

    CL: i'd like to see it as a should

    DS: svg 1.1 has svgfonts as a must
    ... all companies that contributed ipr

    CL: we can have different conformance classes
    ... a maximally conforming profile that MUST support svgfonts

    ED: see no real benefit of doing full svg 1.1 fonts, but 1.2T svg
    fonts are useful

    DS: maybe we could go one step beyond svgt12 font support, but one
    step down from svg 1.1 full
    ... we could say must support svg 2.0 fonts, and you may support e.g
    full video fonts

    CL: we could do alot of tests for svg 1.1 full fonts, and put the
    spec text in the first draft, then possibly drop parts if they're
    not implemented

    ED: JW how about those SVG fonts?

    JW: ask again after SMIL is implemented :)
    ... plan sounds good to me

    DS: hope the market will move quicker to the open format

    <ChrisL> [13]http://www.aip.org/stixfonts/

      [13] http://www.aip.org/stixfonts/

    CL: bunch of fonts for doing maths
    ... you download those fonts, and then you can view mathml
    ... having it as a webfont is good for viewing an occasional
    equation
    ... given away freely
    ... there are two converters to WOFF available
    ... so it's easy for them to do so,
    ... XSL is also looking at adding webfonts in XSL2.0
    ... they'll probably want WOFF format support

    DS: do we have to do anything special for WOFF?

    CL: it's not going to be inline, like an svgfont, well...maybe as a
    datauri
    ... would like to see it in batik

    JW: made a woff demo for ff3.6

    <jwatt>
    [14]http://jwatt.org/svg-open/2009/demos/font-face/web-fonts-in-html
    -and-svg.xhtml

      [14]  
http://jwatt.org/svg-open/2009/demos/font-face/web-fonts-in-html-and-svg.xhtml

    JW: the last one in the dropdown is a woff font

markerPaint

    [15]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2010Feb/0023.html

      [15] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2010Feb/0023.html

    ED: summary: want to inherit styling into the marker element

    CL: could be done with vector effects

    DS: we could have this as a canned effect

    CL: right, like we do with non-scaling-stroke
    ... and as for canned filter effects

    DS: we should keep the usecase in mind when we design svg 2.0

    ED: i raised a few concerns about the proposal there

css scientific notation

    CL: majority was in agreement
    ... pro the scientific notation
    ... it's a change in grammar
    ... it's a flex grammar, which does do scientific notation, but css
    is using a custom variant doing only numbers
    ... css21 doesn't allow it
    ... but the style attribute spec... [lost some bits here]
    ... got an action to write a summary
    ... and a request to have more svg ppl in the discussion
    ... all implementers argued the same position
    ... this is a first bit of svg/css harmonization
    ... will keep you informed

FX taskforce

    <shepazu> [16]http://www.w3.org/2010/fx/effects-task-force.html

      [16] http://www.w3.org/2010/fx/effects-task-force.html

    DS: anthony gave some feedback
    ... don't know how I missed filters, thanks for pointing it out ED

    CL: encoding is bad, use utf8
    ... otherwise looks good to me

    DS: suggest making the few changes, propose a first telcon next
    thursday to discuss the charter
    ... and we should get sylvain galinau (sp?) involved

widgets

    DS: we're rechartering the webapps wg
    ... what's interesting about widgets is that you can have svg only
    content if you want
    ... have made that before, for opera
    ... joined widgets telcon today, an interesting thing came out,
    talked about serverside widgets
    ... you reference it using a object tag, it's just a packaged up
    materials
    ... selfcontained
    ... i've talked to several ppl that wanted to do this with svg's
    ... emphasis is this what flash does
    ... they want to package up everything, helps the workflow
    ... another way svg can be referenced
    ... it's yet another way svg can get used
    ... asked for allowing the manifest to point to a css file, and have
    it apply to any other file

    <shepazu> [$1\47]
    [17]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/05
    73.html

      [17]  
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0573.html

    <shepazu> [$1\47]
    [18]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/05
    69.html

      [18]  
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2010JanMar/0569.html

    DS: makes it possible to separate style and content (the link that
    ties them)

    CL: in XSL it's even worse than CSS
    ... also means you can restyle someone elses content

    ED: sounds similar to the html5 seamless thing
    ... on iframe elements

gradients

    ED: that new wording is going into SVG 1.1 second edition, right?

    AG: the changes are fairly small

    DS: yes, it's svg 1.1 stuff, clarification
    ... does it apply to SVGT12?

    AG: yes

    DS: we should have an errata for 1.2T too then

    CL: the grammar for scientific notation in SVG 1.1 and 1.2T is
    wrong, all implementations ignore that and do the right thing

    ED: let's review the new wording once it's put in place in 1.1
    second edition

    <scribe> ACTION: add new wording for clarifying userspaceonuse
    gradients to SVG 1.1 second edition, and add a corresponding errata
    item for SVG Tiny 1.2 [recorded in
    [19]http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html#action01]

    <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - add

    <scribe> ACTION: AG to add new wording for clarifying userspaceonuse
    gradients to SVG 1.1 second edition, and add a corresponding errata
    item for SVG Tiny 1.2 [recorded in
    [20]http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html#action02]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-2728 - Add new wording for clarifying
    userspaceonuse gradients to SVG 1.1 second edition, and add a
    corresponding errata item for SVG Tiny 1.2 [on Anthony Grasso - due
    2010-02-18].

    <scribe> ACTION: ed to email www-style to announce the FX taskforce
    telcon / charter discussion [recorded in
    [21]http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html#action03]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-2729 - Email www-style to announce the FX
    taskforce telcon / charter discussion [on Erik Dahlström - due
    2010-02-18].

    <scribe> ACTION: CL to fix the broken grammar for scientific
    notation in SVG 1.1 and 1.2T [recorded in
    [22]http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html#action04]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-2730 - Fix the broken grammar for
    scientific notation in SVG 1.1 and 1.2T [on Chris Lilley - due
    2010-02-18].

Summary of Action Items

    [NEW] ACTION: add new wording for clarifying userspaceonuse
    gradients to SVG 1.1 second edition, and add a corresponding errata
    item for SVG Tiny 1.2 [recorded in
    [23]http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html#action01]
    [NEW] ACTION: AG to add new wording for clarifying userspaceonuse
    gradients to SVG 1.1 second edition, and add a corresponding errata
    item for SVG Tiny 1.2 [recorded in
    [24]http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html#action02]
    [NEW] ACTION: CL to fix the broken grammar for scientific notation
    in SVG 1.1 and 1.2T [recorded in
    [25]http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html#action04]
    [NEW] ACTION: ed to email www-style to announce the FX taskforce
    telcon / charter discussion [recorded in
    [26]http://www.w3.org/2010/02/11-svg-minutes.html#action03]

    [End of minutes]
      _________________________________________________________


     Minutes formatted by David Booth's [27]scribe.perl version 1.135
     ([28]CVS log)
     $Date: 2010/02/11 21:32:32 $
      _________________________________________________________

      [27] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
      [28] http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/2002/scribe/

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Found Date: 11 Feb 2010
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-- 
Erik Dahlstrom, Core Technology Developer, Opera Software
Co-Chair, W3C SVG Working Group
Personal blog: http://my.opera.com/macdev_ed
Received on Thursday, 11 February 2010 21:35:44 GMT

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