- From: Dael Jackson <daelcss@gmail.com>
- Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2022 19:10:03 -0400
- To: www-style@w3.org
=========================================
These are the official CSSWG minutes.
Unless you're correcting the minutes,
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with an appropriate subject line.
=========================================
CSS Scoping
-----------
- RESOLVED: Republish when ready (Issue #7494: Publish updated
css-scoping-1 draft?)
Web Animations
--------------
- RESOLVED: The pseudoElement argument to animate() takes any
pseudo-element selector, and selects the first matching
pseudo-element like querySelector() (Issue #7469: Enable
using Web Animations API with nested pseudo elements)
Scroll Animations
-----------------
- RESOLVED: In the absence of scroll range, timeline becomes inactive
(Issue #7401: currentTime when scroll range is 0?)
===== FULL MEETING MINUTES ======
Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2022Jul/0004.html
Present:
Rachel Andrew
Adam Argyle
Rossen Atanassov
David Baron
Oriol Brufau
Emilio Cobos Álvarez
Robert Flack
Simon Fraser
Daniel Holbert
Brad Kemper
Jonathan Kew
Vladimir Levin
Daniel Libby
Chris Lilley
Peter Linss
Alison Maher
Ben Mathwig
Khushal Sagar
Jen Simmons
Alan Stearns
Miriam Suzanne
Bramus Van Damme
Lea Verou
Regrets:
Tab Atkins Bittner
Mike Bremford
Elika Etemad
Florian Rivoal
Sebastian Zartner
Scribe: emilio
Agenda & Planning
=================
Rossen: Should be good to bring the conversation about isVisible back
to the WG
Rossen: Other topic is that I'd be attending the next weekly TAG F2F
so this is the last meeting before seeing folks in person
Rossen: Please register / change the wiki for last minute changes
<astearns> https://wiki.csswg.org/planning/nyc-2022
Rossen: fantasai is organizing from another country so it'd be great
to make this first hybrid meeting a success
CSS Scoping
===========
Publish updated css-scoping-1 draft?
-------------------------------------
github: https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/7494
lea: I recently pulled up the spec and since drafts.csswg.org was
down I used the last published draft
lea: last published version is from 2014, which is too long ago
<chris> +1
chris: I just updated the draft changes so I think it should be good
to publish
Rossen: Given fantasai and TabAtkins are out happy to resolve and let
them bring it back next week if needed
<miriam> https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/5809#issuecomment-910896765
miriam: We resolved a while ago to reorganize some of the scoping
features
[see comment above]
chris: I don't recall everything but some of those changes have been
made
miriam: Only concern is to keep clear what belongs where, but not
opposed to republish
jensimmons: I think the scoping spec is not about scoping because
those bits are from the cascade spec
jensimmons: There's confusion because there's a whole bunch of
scoping ideas
jensimmons: so if you search for css scoping you end up in the wrong
place
jensimmons: so it'd be clearer if the spec was called shadow
chris: I'm in favor of pushing specs forward, but if we're going to
cause confusion I'd rather wait a week or two
<lea> not sure anyone is actively following when a new draft is
published…
<chris> not opposed to a resolution
Rossen: Feedback is great to draw attention on some of the historical
context. Doubt tab / fantasai would press the button just
because they see a resolution
Rossen: We should capture everything needed to republish
Rossen: objections to republish when tab / fantasai are ready?
<chris> also good if the introduction had, well, text
<chris> 1. Introduction ...
RESOLVED: Republish when ready
<jensimmons> And thanks lea for pointing out this needed to be
republished!
Web Animations
==============
Enable using Web Animations API with nested pseudo elements
-----------------------------------------------------------
github: https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/7469
khush: This is about supporting nested pseudos in web-animations API
khush: There's an option to pass a string that right now is limited
to direct descendants of the element
khush: so you can do `::before` but not `::before::marker`
khush: Proposal is allowing any kind of syntax
khush: to allow you to select nested pseudos
khush: you could also use the descendant selector
khush: which is a nicer syntax to select a pseudo-tree
khush: There's the question of what to do when it matches multiple
selectors
khush: so there's the option to make it invalid, or select the first
like querySelector
flackr: If you can match multiple pseudos, does that mean that we're
introducing a case where the pseudo-element can change over
time?
flackr: dunno if there are cases like this
khush: I'd say to select the pseudo-element when you make the
animate() call
khush: and animation would terminate, just like you can remove
`::before` styles mid-animation and the animation stops
flackr: I suspect we should do this in the next lifecycle update so
that there's no forced style resolution on `animate()`
khush: That's pre-existing I think, we already do that
flackr: Also current behavior is that animations keep running when
the element disappears, and if it comes back it restarts
khush: Not sure
flackr: It'd be good to match the existing behavior for single pseudos
flackr: not sure if this complicates matters a bit but there are
existing patterns to follow
Rossen: So for the multiple pseudo case do you think we should stick
to querySelector() or...?
khush: I'd say we should do that
emilio: When you say any selector, what do you mean? you can't put
any selector. Is there a syntax to define what exactly will
be allowed?
khush: When I say any selector I mean anything that targets
pseudo-elements, so just `::before::marker`-like selectors and
`::before>>=::marker`
RESOLVED: The pseudoElement argument to animate() takes any
pseudo-element selector, and selects the first matching
pseudo-element like querySelector()
emilio: Can we resolve to make it consistent for getComputedStyle and
similar
<flackr> +1
<khush> +1
Rossen: As part of this or in a separate issue?
emilio: Ideally while we're at it, but happy to defer
Rossen: Let's have it in a separate issue
<oriol> For getComputedStyle there is
https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/4456
Scroll Animations
=================
currentTime when scroll range is 0?
-----------------------------------
github: https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/7401
flackr: When you have a scroll timeline the currentTime is
effectively the scroll-position / range of scroll
flackr: but if there's no scroll range then you'd have division by
zero / infinite range
flackr: We think that the timeline should become inactive when in
this state
flackr: rather than being at the beginning or end or something
Rossen: Makes sense, question would be: if you have a scrollport that
has content which isn't exceeding the scrollable bounds and
you resize it, you're saying that only when you have scroll
range the timeline is valid
Rossen: Numerically I get your point
Rossen: in the case when the scrollport resizes
Rossen: What does that do to the animation?
Rossen: you said the timeline becomes invalid?
flackr: Inactive, which is an existing state, where the currentTime
is null
flackr: so basically if you resize so that it's not scrollable the
effects will no longer apply
emilio: When you stop applying the effects the animation doesn't
pause right? You get discontinuity
flackr: That's right, is not weirder than having a very small scroll
range
dbaron: Can you have overscroll in these elements?
flackr: I don't think so
flackr: Depends on browser, I think on ~all browsers you don't get
overscroll effect
flackr: but on safari desktop it does
flackr: There's also the question of whether the overscroll effect
factors in the scroll timeline
dbaron: I was just wondering if you could end up with weird effects
in the overscroll effect
flackr: I think we'd still not have a reasonable range
flackr: I think we shouldn't factor the negative range into the effect
flackr: it's more stuff to worry about for developers, plus browsers
don't technically limit the amount of stuff you can overscroll
<smfr> I agree with not applying overscroll here
dbaron: That's a good enough answer I think
RESOLVED: In the absence of scroll range, timeline becomes inactive
Schedule Wrangling
==================
scribe: dholbert
[Discussion about what to discuss based on who has sent regrets this
week]
Rossen: That's the end of the agenda+ items that we can make progress
on...
Rossen: End early? Additional topics?
dholbert: How are we deciding issues for f2f?
Rossen: If you have issues that you want to be available on & you
haven't posted your availability on the wiki, please do so
Rossen: I'll add a section in wiki where folks can express
issue-number-preferences (to be present for)
Rossen: Alan and I will do our github-project agenda prep stuff the
week before
dbaron: I noticed at least one spec that had a TR publication that
did not include images. This is because bikeshed-echidna will
support certain files but not all files in the directory [?]
dbaron: I fixed all specs that I noticed being wrong, putting their
images in an images directory (for diagrams)
<chris> dbaron++ nicely done
dbaron: There were about 10 affected specs; not sure how many had
been accidentally published without images via echidna
emilio: Does anyone know status of the csswg draft server, and if we
can avoid its frequent downtime?
chris: plinss said he has funding coming, improvements coming soon
<chris> woohoo!
Rossen: we're ending early!
<vmpstr> we're done with css, good job all
<bramus> Thanks everyone and see you soon.
Received on Wednesday, 20 July 2022 23:10:44 UTC