- From: MURATA Makoto <eb2m-mrt@asahi-net.or.jp>
- Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2012 15:14:47 +0900
- To: koba@antenna.co.jp
- Cc: "www-style@w3.org" <www-style@w3.org>
Kobayashi-san, I agree that "how to select a proper glyph shape and glyph metrics for each character in vertical writing mode" is an important issue and I did not mention it in my mail. This is about the property value "T" in "Property Values for the East Asian Orientation Property" in Unicode TR#50. I just mentioned "U" and "S" in the same property. In your blog, you argue against font-independent determination. I am interested in further discussions about this topic. Regards, Makoto 2012年1月14日13:50 <koba@antenna.co.jp>: > Murata-san > > It seems to me this is different issue from the default choice of a) and > b) shown in "3.2.3 Mixed Text Composition in Vertical Writing Mode". > > The choice a) is set by text-orientation: upright, b)is text-orientation: > upright-right. This specification is no problem. > > But the issue is how to select a proper glyph shape and glyph metrics for > each character in vertical writing mode. CSS WG rejects modern > font-technology, and trying to make a original mapping table. This may > cause a serious issue in Japanese typesetting, may become a show stopper > of EPUB in Japan. > > I am now carefully reviewing the issue. Please refer to: > http://blog.cas-ub.com/?p=614 (sorry this is in Japanese). > > Regards, > > Tokushige Kobayashi > > >> Brady, >> >> This is about the default choice of a) and b) shown in >> "3.2.3 Mixed Text Composition in Vertical Writing Mode" in >> the W3C Note "Requirements for Japanese Text Layout". >> Which of the two is default for which character? UTR#50 >> is intended to make this point clear, but different opinions >> certaily exist even in Japan. >> >> http://www.w3.org/TR/jlreq/#en-subheading2_2_2 >> >> Regards, >> Makoto >> >> 2012/1/14 Brady Duga <duga@ljug.com>: >>> Hi Koji, >>> >>> This all sounds great - always nice to see someone working on >>> interoperability tests! I am little confused by the problem they have >>> with >>> glyph orientation. Is this just a failure of some UAs to properly apply >>> glyph substitutions when rendering vertical text, or is it more complex >>> then >>> that? >>> >>> --Brady >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Jan 13, 2012 at 9:10 AM, Koji Ishii <kojiishi@gluesoft.co.jp> >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> I had a meeting with Kadokawa, one of the biggest publishing company >>>> group >>>> in Japan. Guys working on EPUB in Japan had setup a meeting with them >>>> and >>>> kindly invited me, so I'm writing this to share what I heard at the >>>> meeting >>>> with whom interested in digital publishing situations in Japan. >>>> >>>> About a month ago, the EBPAJ (The Electronic Book Publishers >>>> Association >>>> of Japan)[1] made an announcement[2] that they have started a project >>>> to >>>> test interoperability of EPUB readers. As EPUB3 became REC last >>>> October, and >>>> readers started appearing in the market, they soon realized that >>>> interoperability is one of the issues they need to resolve. The EBPAJ >>>> is >>>> primarily focused on magazines, and Kadokawa is one of the central >>>> member of >>>> the activity within the EBPAJ. >>>> >>>> They believe in future of EPUB and W3C technologies so much that they >>>> want >>>> to solve problems they can, and this project is one of such efforts. >>>> They're >>>> planning to do the followings in this project: >>>> >>>> 1. Listen to the member publishers to create a list of features and >>>> test >>>> cases they would care. >>>> 2. Create a test suite and ask which features vendors support. The >>>> group >>>> will also run tests for major readers and browsers by themselves. >>>> 3. Publish the result so that content holders can decide which >>>> platforms >>>> to support. They expect the result also helps creating in-house rules >>>> to >>>> author interoperable HTML/CSS/EPUB for readers/browsers they want to >>>> support. They target to publish the result on March 2012. >>>> >>>> They also mentioned that the glyph orientation in vertical text flow is >>>> one of the issues they are looking into, which is one of the hottest >>>> topic >>>> in writing-modes[3] and UTR#50[4]. It used to happen in the past that >>>> digital publishing platforms rendering different glyph orientation by >>>> OS/fonts, so they were not surprised much, but they recognized that >>>> EPUB has >>>> the issue and that they need to investigate further. They're welcoming >>>> our >>>> efforts to define orientations in the spec, although, no promise on >>>> dates is >>>> one of the biggest concern. How they would test it hasn't finalized >>>> yet, >>>> I'll keep in touch with them. >>>> >>>> It looked to me that they were a bit surprised that many symbol and >>>> punctuation glyphs used in their contents appear in sideways in today's >>>> implementations, more than in other existing digital publishing >>>> platforms. >>>> But they're professional content holders that, once spec was finalized >>>> and >>>> implemented (or they have figured out behavior if spec didn't meet >>>> their >>>> timeframe,) they could create internal rules or system to wrap every >>>> symbol >>>> and punctuation character in <span>s and set the text-orientation >>>> property[5] on them. They said they can live with any rules as long as >>>> the >>>> rules are clear, there's a workaround (i.e., span + text-orientation >>>> property,) and it won't change, but it still holds true that the less >>>> <span>s they need to use, the better. >>>> >>>> [1] http://www.ebpaj.jp/ (Japanese) >>>> [2] http://www.ebpaj.jp/images/epub_20111216.pdf (Japanese) >>>> [3] http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css3-writing-modes/ >>>> [4] http://www.unicode.org/reports/tr50/ >>>> [5] http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css3-writing-modes/#text-orientation >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> Koji >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Praying for the victims of the Japan Tohoku earthquake >> >> Makoto >> >> > > -- Praying for the victims of the Japan Tohoku earthquake Makoto
Received on Saturday, 14 January 2012 06:15:39 UTC