W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-style@w3.org > November 2011

Re: [css3-ui] drop 'appearance' and related properties

From: Tab Atkins Jr. <jackalmage@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 24 Nov 2011 19:34:36 -0800
Message-ID: <CAAWBYDDKFhH6k4zFZ_B+Ma4X44oPR5x6wWD=Vew9D839am+8zA@mail.gmail.com>
To: John Daggett <jdaggett@mozilla.com>
Cc: www-style <www-style@w3.org>
On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 8:16 PM, John Daggett <jdaggett@mozilla.com> wrote:
> The CSS3 UI module includes a section entitled "Appearance" (currently
> section 5) [1].  The properties described in this section allow
> arbitrary elements to mimic the appearance/fonts/colors of system UI
> elements.
>
> I don't see the need for these properties, they originated in an era
> when "themed" system UI's were popular, based on the ability to control
> system UI colors/fonts/appearance at a fine-grained level in Windows and
> other windowing systems.  This begat lots of UI awfulness ("Look Mom,
> all your windows with Halloween colors, wee...").  These days most
> platforms have removed the fine-grained controls (e.g. Windows 7 buries
> these and Windows 8 removes them entirely) and user agents generally try
> to mimic the system-level UI for common elements (buttons, checkboxes,
> etc.).  And HTML5 has expanded the number of controls available to
> authors so there's less need to produce homebrew controls.
>
> I realize both Webkit and Mozilla include prefixed '-xxx-appearance'
> properties but I'm not sure I see the need to standardize these.  Given
> the current diversity of UI's in use across desktop and mobile platforms
> I think this is difficult to standardize in a way that would really
> serve a worthy purpose.
>
> I also don't see the need to add more system font names, since many of
> these won't make sense in different contexts.  (And the CSS3 UI spec is
> the wrong place to be defining the 'font' property since it currently
> lives in CSS3 Fonts).
>
> I think the WG should resolve to drop the properties and additions
> described in this section of CSS3 UI before publishing a new draft.

In practice, I believe that "appearance:none" is occasionally required
in some UAs (like WebKit, iirc) to turn off the native rendering of
some controls and allow full CSS styling.  This is all a big ball of
undefined behavior, though, so shrug.

~TJ
Received on Friday, 25 November 2011 03:35:29 GMT

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