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[css3-writing-modes] text-orientation: upright (was RE: Minutes and Resolutions 2011-07-13

From: Koji Ishii <kojiishi@gluesoft.co.jp>
Date: Thu, 14 Jul 2011 00:37:18 -0400
To: "www-style@w3.org" <www-style@w3.org>
Message-ID: <A592E245B36A8949BDB0A302B375FB4E0AC4D1B1CE@MAILR001.mail.lan>
I've got the same question as Sylvain asked:

> Writing Modes
> -------------
>   :
>   sylvaing: I would like to see use cases that can be understood by me and
>             the rest of the group.
>   szilles: we are trying to define the default behavior.
>   sylvaing: I would like to see the requirements and use cases. They would
>             be helpful.
>   * ChrisL suggests sylvain express that in email
>   szilles: the original requirements came from Michel.

I saw negative responses to the bidi-style resolution fantasai wrote[1], but from what I understood by reading the e-mail, she herself is against that too. She came up with the proposal because there was a request to improve the current 'text-orientation: upright'[2] behavior, correct? I'm not a fan of bidi-style resolution either, but before that, what I don't understand is why the current ED needs revised.

John said that the Figure 7 of the spec[3] has both upright "2011" and sideways "2011". But as Steve said, this can be solved by the distinction of ASCII and full-width code points today. While I agree that it's nice if CSS can invent a new method to do this without relying on full-width code points, it's an advanced feature.

What I want to writing-modes level 3 is just a good default behavior, and I'd like it be close to what Windows and MacOS X Lion[4] does today. That gives consistent behavior with other applications, and matches to what native East Asians have been used to. Within the proposals currently discussed -- the current ED, surrounding characters, bidi-style resolution, script markup -- I think the current ED is the closest to the goal. It is also the closest to the original requirements came from Michel if I understand that correctly.

So, if we were going to discuss how to improve 'text-orientation: upright' behavior, I'd like to know what use cases we're trying to solve. If the use case is advanced enough to punt to level 4, I'd like to keep the one defined in the current ED.

I appreciate discussions to make it clearer to readers and easier to read, but I don't want advanced features. We all know a lot of people are waiting for this spec to be done, right?

[1] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2011Jul/0004.html
[2] http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css3-writing-modes/#text-orientation
[3] http://dev.w3.org/csswg/css3-writing-modes/#fig-mac
[4] http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/11/04/08/inside_mac_os_x_10_7_lion_textedit_adds_vertical_layout_graphical_toolbar.html

Received on Thursday, 14 July 2011 04:37:24 UTC

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