W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-style@w3.org > June 2009

[CSSWG] Minutes F2F 2009-06-03 Part II: Scheduling, Website, text-overflow, DoC format

From: fantasai <fantasai.lists@inkedblade.net>
Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2009 23:27:23 -0700
Message-ID: <4A388CCB.2000709@inkedblade.net>
To: www-style@w3.org
Upcoming Meetings

   tpac is 2-3 nov 2009
   SteveZ: are we meeting the sunday as well?
   (we look at march 2010)
   dbaron: time for a north american meeting
   ChrisL: www2010 is 26-30 april in raleigh
   <ChrisL> http://www2010.org/www/
   Daniel: yes but we need a meeting in between
   (hakon offers oslo in february, to laughter)
   (brainstorming on dates and locations. speculation as to tpac 2010
    site and date)
   proposed: bay area in march, several hosting possibilities, easy for
             peter linss to get to
   Daniel: after 8 march
   Sylvain: sxsw etc overlaps
   dbaron: sxsw is mar 12-16
   Molly: crazy week, mix right after
   proposed: 22-24 march, bay area
   adobe, mozilla as possible hosts
   <jdaggett> proposed: apple hosts
   hakon proposes oslo in august or june
   howcome: the more meetings, the lower the attendance
   SteveZ: perfer to avoid 16
   18-20 August 2010, Oslo
   and then see about tpac
   <dbaron> I just updated http://www.w3.org/Style/Group/meetings.html with
            "(tentative)" entries for the two meetings we just planned.
            Somebody else should check I got everything right, though.
   <ChrisL> yup, looks good

role of molly, liaison, use cases, website

   Molly: we had jason teague, did a lot of work, and it was put aside
          and lost momentum
   Molly: bert did some work but we lost the information architecture
   Molly: so would like to project manage that to bring to fruition
   fantasai: that would be great
   Bert: want to keep existing links and names of pages (cool links don't break)
   Bert: thought i used the structure
   fantasai: layout but not the information architecture
   Bert: public pages, i'm responsible and have to be maintainable
   Bert: and chris as well
   Bert: so don't want to learn new tools
   Bert: have some make scripts, eg for translations
   Bert: structure, what did I do wrong there?
   Bert posts a link
   Bert: this is a temporary page and will go away
   Bert: trimmed out links to other w3c groups
   Bert: also made top left menu shorter
   fantasai: news and current work are very long , unstructured. Our design
             had a structure, not just the page but the whole site.
   fantasai: set up a structure to understand the site. but this is a huge
             long list
   fantasai: jasons draft did not have the long lists
   Bert: oh, i didn't use his latest work, didn't like it
   fantasai: propose that we take berts draft and rearrange the content to
             have the current work in a smaller or secondary page
   Molly: needs to be clear and simple with links to further information
   fantasai: drowned in long list of news items
   SteveZ: keep top 3
   Molly: replace current work with an intro, link to more details
   (discussion on whether the design is too big)
   Molly: its a current design trend, big and bold
   Molly: boxes need to be smaller, to the point. this is designer/developer
          outreach, not for coders
   Molly:  Ilike richard ishidas site, very clean
   Molly: this may be a bit over designed
   jdaggett: just needs itghtening to a higher information density
   Bert: ok, that would be easy, trimming news items, replacing table with
         an intro
   fantasai: in our design, little boxes to introduce topics
   fantasai: actual sections, not random links. need to impose a structure
   <jdaggett> jdaggett: many thumbs up for this...
   fantasai: and navigation header represents these topics across all subpages
   Molly: just presenting the material well. tighten up and match the
          information to the audience and a consistent navigation scheme
   fantasai: so I suggest I work with molly to show bert what we mean
   Bert: top bar has three items as well as the home page
   SteveZ: want a quick way to see whats on *this* page
   SteveZ: lots below the fold
   ChrisL: maybe tabs to give an overview
   fantasai: so small boxes, if its short you can see the whole thing at a glance
   Molly: good info, but does not all belong on home page
   Molly: so elika and i will work on that and i can manage this
   Molly: people expect more of w3c in terms of usable information

   Molly: which brings us to community outreach and liaison
   Molly: to drive traffic we need attractive resources, then use twitter
   Molly: its our relationship to the world
   Molly: fundamental, and missing
   Molly: social networking can enhance this and I want to work on that.
          developers want to be more involved, but designers find it hard
          to track whats going on
   jdaggett: is this really aimed at content developers?
   jdaggett: desigers spend a lot of time on edge cases caused by poor interop
   Bert: there is the blog as well
   Daniel: demo pages
   Daniel: want to see demo pages for new stuff, with an explanation below.
           short articles
   Molly: showing use of features, best practices
   Molly: community liaison is what I am best at
   Daniel: template with container elements
   SteveZ: so what happens if the browser does not implement the feature?
   <Bert> http://www.w3.org/Style/Examples/011/firstcss
   <Bert> http://www.w3.org/Style/Examples/007/
   Molly: understanding of css is still very low. need to teach the current
          stuff as well as the upcoming stuff
   SteveZ: sure, but want to see a screen cap as well to show what it should
           look like
   Molly: or video
   Daniel: example, using :target to do tabs
   Bert: the links above are some of the most popoular pages
   Bert: need something between absolute beginners and expert level
   Molly: in colleges people are learning products like dreamweaver, not
          standards. show what they need to know now wnd what is coming later
   jdaggett: we have decided to move modules forward independently so there
             is no css3
   jdaggett: the outside world sees it as a monolithic entity and wonders
             where it is
   Molly: educators need to find a new terminology that is consistent with
          the module structure
   Molly: educators and evangelists need materials to work with
   Molly: its a bunch of pieces, not a versioning system
   ChrisL: key message is the relevance of css 2.1, module s add to it,
           doesn't throw it all away
   Molly: also want to call to the community
   SteveZ: snapshots should replace css3. css3 snapshots, then drop the "3".
           its whats realistic today
   Molly: so all of this, the outfacing site, the comunity liaison - give
          designers ownership and make them feel part of it
   fantasai: also we need feedback /from/ designers
   Molly: via social networks
   Daniel: so we all agree to assign this to molly?
   (general agreement)
   Bert: how to keep in touch?
   ChrisL: concerns over the group not being as public as the charter says
           it should be
   jdaggett: one thing is to work out how defined a feature is and to not
             talk up highly unstable stuff
   <fantasai> ChrisL, we try to keep administrivia on the internal list,
              in general that's the only thing that should be going to
              the internal list
   <fantasai> ChrisL, if technical issues get sent internally, it's an
              error on the senders part and should be resent to www-style
   div class="two column hack"


Scribe: Arron
   <fantasai> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2009May/0167.html
   <fantasai> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-style/2008Aug/0271.html
   fantasai: vertical overflow or jsut the last line
   Alex: and ellipsis only mase sense on the last line not always in the middle
   fantasai: (drawing ellipsis examples)
   Bert: how automatic are the rules for ellipsis
   ChrisL: what happens when scrolling? does the ellipsis stay with last line?
   fantasai: yes
   dbaron: if its a single line we may need a special case for not clipping
   fantasai: do we want to handle both cases for text-overflow vertical and
   do we want to add additional properties
   Molly: what would designers expect and how would it be clipped
   fantasai: when there is an ellipsis the text just goes away and is
             referenced by the ellipsis
   RESOLVED: text overflow in case of vertical overflow still applies to
             individual lines

Disposition of Comments Format

   Writing disposition of comments after last call
   Daniel explains color coding
   of dispositions of comments
   Green means resolved
   Orange means deferred
   Red means unresolved
   ChrisL: the idea is a standard for disposition of comments
   Anne: I used orange to mean rejected, and red to mean formal objection
   <howcome> howcome has joined #css
   ChrisL: one solution is to have two columns
   dbaron: For Color I had a separate color for rejected features that
           were objections
   dbaron: whoever reads it should define the standards for this
   ChrisL: lets ask for examples of good practices
   ChrisL: ask Ian or some of the chairs
   ACTION: Daniel to send email asking about standards for color codings
           and disposition of comments
Received on Wednesday, 17 June 2009 07:48:15 UTC

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.3.1 : Monday, 2 May 2016 14:38:27 UTC