W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-style@w3.org > May 2002

RE: canvas <html> <body>

From: Manos Batsis <m.batsis@bsnet.gr>
Date: Thu, 2 May 2002 10:29:59 +0300
Message-ID: <E657D8576967CF448D6AF22CB42DD2690FF271@ermhs.Athens.BrokerSystems.gr>
To: "George Lund" <george@lundbooks.co.uk>
Cc: <www-style@w3.org>

> From: George Lund [mailto:george@lundbooks.co.uk] 

> XML just provides a meta-language so the actual uses to which 
> it is put 
> depend entirely on the application.  Some applications will 
> be suitable 
> for direct styling of the contents using CSS, some will not. 
> An example 
> of an XML application that manifestly is not suitable for 
> this would be 
> SVG; also RDF. 

The only reason CSS alone is not enough to style SVG and RDF is that
these structures are very different when compared with their semantics,
something not true for XHTML.

> Generic mark-up is *not*for use on the WWW; only predefined 
> applications 
> agreed between the parties in advance. 

I have to partially disagree; again, the applicability of CSS to style
any XML vocabulary depends on the vocabulary structure when compared
with it's semantics.

> XHTML explicitly does not require CSS. 

Actually, XHTML demands the use of CSS by authors. Many markup
properties where deprecated in favor of CSS properties.

> We shouldn't confuse 
> the way one 
> browser (Mozilla) has chosen to implement XHTML with the 
> principles of 
> separated style and semantics.

Mozilla is considered the best implementation thus far. Also, that's
what 'cascading' is all about ;-)

> XHTML makes no requirements 
> about which 
> element is the canvas, regardless of whether it is served as 
> text/html 
> or text/xml.

Ok I can't argue with that right now :-)

>  Nor can CSS demand (AFAIK) that the root element of a 
> document be 'styleable', because CSS is generic enough to be 
> applied to 
> (e.g.) elements of an SVG document.

Hmm. Well, this is a problem. You see, if all the content of the html
element is stylable, then that element must be stylable as well because
it effects the child elements. That's why all my stylesheets have


Anyway, I strongly believe that as far XHTML is concerned, all
presentational attributes must be deprecated in favor of existing or new
(possibly in an XHTML module for CSS 3) CSS ones. This will make XHTML
easier to use as vanilla XML to store data, which is what separation of
content and presentation is about.

Best regards,

Received on Thursday, 2 May 2002 03:30:07 UTC

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