From: Helder Ferreira <hfilipe@fe.up.pt>

Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 14:51:18 +0100

Message-ID: <00e601c447df$86e94490$456aa8c0@blue>

To: "Andreas Strotmann" <Strotmann@rrz.uni-koeln.de>

Cc: <David.Pawson@rnib.org.uk>, <www-math@w3.org>, "Diamantino Freitas" <dfreitas@fe.up.pt>

Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2004 14:51:18 +0100

Message-ID: <00e601c447df$86e94490$456aa8c0@blue>

To: "Andreas Strotmann" <Strotmann@rrz.uni-koeln.de>

Cc: <David.Pawson@rnib.org.uk>, <www-math@w3.org>, "Diamantino Freitas" <dfreitas@fe.up.pt>

Hi Andreas, True. MathML Content Markup seems at first better. However there are 2 open issues: (1) MathML Content Markup only covers basic math. The operator's dictionary and support is not very big. OpenMath is doing a better job on that. (2) Who uses MathML Content Markup in WebPages? Noone. The major contribution on the web is based on Presentation-Markup. So seems to me that a program that speaks MathML needs to understand Presentation Markup too. Concluding the following: 1. A program that does MathML Audio Rendering needs to support both Content and Presentation Markup. 2. By parsing Presentation and interpreting the markup we are in deed doing a kind of Presentation to Content Markup (which is not an easy task, and not being implemented yet), and then converting the meaning of the mathematical expression into plain text and therefore in audio using a TTS. Regards, Helder ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andreas Strotmann" <Strotmann@rrz.uni-koeln.de> To: "Helder Ferreira" <hfilipe@fe.up.pt> Cc: <David.Pawson@rnib.org.uk>; <www-math@w3.org>; "Diamantino Freitas" <dfreitas@fe.up.pt> Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2004 2:24 PM Subject: Re: mathml to plain text | audio? > Note that even though Aster is used to render LaTeX, T.V. Raman's > dissertation makes it clear that his system does an enormous amount of > work to recognize the logical structure of the formulas it reads. > > If I understand T.V.Raman correctly, for text / audio rendering, > MathML-Content should therefore be a much better-quality input than > MathML-Presentation, and I suspect that MathML-Presentation text/audio > rendering should really be done as a two-phase process that first does > MathML-Presentation to MathML-Content recognition. > > -- Andreas > > Helder Ferreira wrote: > > > You can also look into the T.V. Raman's work about ASTER.- > > http://www.cs.cornell.edu/Info/People/raman/aster/demo.html . > > However ASTER works for Latex documents. Nevertheless, you can transform > > Latex to MathML (see http://www.orcca.on.ca/MathML/texmml/textomml.html ). > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: <David.Pawson@rnib.org.uk> > > To: <www-math@w3.org> > > Sent: Tuesday, June 01, 2004 12:52 PM > > Subject: mathml to plain text | audio? > > > > > > > >> > >>www.daisy.org is a group of organisations who produce smil based > >>'talking books'. Synchronised text and audio for blind and partially > >>sighted people. > >> > >>We are starting to look at incorporating mathml into our schema, > >>and that's fine for producing braille, just hard work. > >> > >>However, for 'spoken' math(s), it presents a problem of automation. > >>For more complex stuff, human readers tend to make mistakes, hence > >>synthetic speech is often used. > >> > >>Put simply, mathml isn't 'readable' in its XML format (my view :-). > >>Certainly if serialised it wouldn't sound very good via a TTS engine. > >> > >>I'm informed others have looked at mathml to 'plain text' transforms, > >> perhaps with paragraph level formatting. > >>I'm wondering if any such transforms are available open source, or could > >>be licenced to the daisy group for our readers? > >> > >>Any pointers appreciated. > >> > >>Regards DaveP. > >>www.rnib.org.uk > >> > >>Not subscribed to this list, so please copy me in. > >> > >> > >>**** snip here ***** > >> > >>-- > >>DISCLAIMER: > >> > >>NOTICE: The information contained in this email and any attachments is > >>confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended > >>recipient you should not use, disclose, distribute or copy any of the > >>content of it or of any attachment; you are requested to notify the > >>sender immediately of your receipt of the email and then to delete it > >>and any attachments from your system. > >> > >>RNIB endeavours to ensure that emails and any attachments generated by > >>its staff are free from viruses or other contaminants. However, it > >>cannot accept any responsibility for any such which are transmitted. > >>We therefore recommend you scan all attachments. > >> > >>Please note that the statements and views expressed in this email and > >>any attachments are those of the author and do not necessarily represent > >>those of RNIB. > >> > >>RNIB Registered Charity Number: 226227 > >> > >>Website: http://www.rnib.org.uk > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > >Received on Tuesday, 1 June 2004 09:51:55 GMT

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