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[minutes] Internationalization telecon 2017-09-07

From: r12a <ishida@w3.org>
Date: Fri, 8 Sep 2017 15:44:57 +0100
To: www International <www-international@w3.org>
Message-ID: <271c484e-83c7-1384-e56c-46bd40e90130@w3.org>
https://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html





text extract follows:



- DRAFT -

            Internationalization Working Group Teleconference

07 Sep 2017

    [2]Agenda

       [2] 
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-core/2017Sep/0002.html

    See also: [3]IRC log

       [3] http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-irc

Attendees

    Present
           Bert, addison, steve, r12a, David, andrewc, JcK

    Regrets
    Chair
           Addison Phillips

    Scribe
           addison

Contents

      * [4]Topics
          1. [5]Agenda
          2. [6]Action Items
          3. [7]Info Share
          4. [8]Radar and Active Work Review
          5. [9]Review pending and close items
          6. [10]Remote Playback API
          7. [11]Review pending and close items
          8. [12]AOB?
      * [13]Summary of Action Items
      * [14]Summary of Resolutions
      __________________________________________________________

    trackbot, prepare teleconference

    <scribe> ScribeNick: addison

Agenda

Action Items

    [15]https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/open

      [15] https://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/open

    action-636?

    <trackbot> action-636 -- Addison Phillips to Update floating
    times q+a to address confusing section at end -- due 2017-07-20
    -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [16]http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/636

      [16] http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/636

    [17]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-drafts/pull/111

      [17] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-drafts/pull/111

    action-647?

    <trackbot> action-647 -- Richard Ishida to Send list of review
    items for next week (pendings and close? items) -- due
    2017-09-07 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [18]http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/647

      [18] http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/647

    close action-647

    <trackbot> Closed action-647.

    action-648?

    <trackbot> action-648 -- Richard Ishida to Ask mongolian ad hoc
    group to use our list -- due 2017-09-07 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [19]http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/648

      [19] http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/648

    close action-648

    <trackbot> Closed action-648.

    action-649?

    <trackbot> action-649 -- Addison Phillips to Reply to whatwg
    2945 translatehint issue with wg opinion -- due 2017-09-07 --
    OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [20]http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/649

      [20] http://www.w3.org/International/track/actions/649

    close action-649

    <trackbot> Closed action-649.

Info Share

    david: small piece
    ... looking at jdk9 spec
    ... aiming to do better bidi support

    addison: maybe making isolation work?

    richard: tpac is coming!
    ... the goose is getting fat
    ... consider registering
    ... if you wish to attend

    <r12a> [21]https://www.w3.org/2017/11/TPAC/

      [21] https://www.w3.org/2017/11/TPAC/

    <David> [22]https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8043825

      [22] https://bugs.openjdk.java.net/browse/JDK-8043825

    <r12a> [23]https://www.chinaw3c.org/tpac2017-overview.html

      [23] https://www.chinaw3c.org/tpac2017-overview.html

Radar and Active Work Review

    [24]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/projects/1

      [24] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/projects/1

    [25]http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/projects/

      [25] http://w3c.github.io/i18n-activity/projects/

    richard: talked to shervin and he'll try to produce something
    for arabic (gap review)

    bert: looking at dutch, not finished yet
    ... will send

    richard: when you get to paged media stuff
    ... are there i18n features that are not supported. lots of
    features not supported
    ... but we're only considering the i18n ones
    ... things such as making page turn direction in arabic
    ... the ij thing might be one, it's unicode related
    ... maybe important to consider

Review pending and close items

Remote Playback API

    [26]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/274#issuecommen
    t-327103198

      [26] 
https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/274#issuecomment-327103198

    <scribe> ACTION: addison: write to remote playback and indicate
    that we are satisfied and our review is in fact complete
    [recorded in
    [27]http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html#action01]

      [27] http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html#action01

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-650 - Write to remote playback and
    indicate that we are satisfied and our review is in fact
    complete [on Addison Phillips - due 2017-09-14].

Review pending and close items

    [28]https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-international/2017
    JulSep/0088.html

      [28] 
https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-international/2017JulSep/0088.html

    [29]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/473

      [29] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/473

    richard: maybe too late
    ... but don't like the word justify here
    ... this is about aligning or arranging
    ... I wish to tilt at this windmill please?

    addison: agree

    david: use of justify is unjustifiable

    bert: problem css knows about, but hasn't come to satifying
    conclusion
    ... words are internally consistent, but words overloaded
    ... haven't found anything better, variations of 'align' are
    equally obscure

    richard: suggesting 'arrange', notice that powerpoint uses the
    word
    ... question is whether CSS Grid went out and use justify?

    bert: not sure if all of them

    [30]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/474

      [30] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/474

    richard: asking for a brief summary of what happens in simple
    cases

    addison: is that really an i18n comment?

    richard: well, has to do with which baseline

    bert: thought there use to be illustrations?

    richard: still exist in another spec
    ... didn't manage to make that connect to what they say here

    (possibly line module??)

    (no objections)

    [31]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/396

      [31] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/396

    richard: matches items to a list
    ... matches capital and lowercase in list
    ... should we do normalization too?

    [32]http://w3c.github.io/charmod-norm/#handlingCaseFolding

      [32] http://w3c.github.io/charmod-norm/#handlingCaseFolding

    addison: turkish for example

    andrew: vietnamese input methods may require normalization
    ... user may not be inputting the same string
    ... for the same word

    richard: really useful feature though
    ... use in uniview

    jck: gray area between identifier case and free text case

    addison: if we don't say anything, the default implementation
    will be ascii friendly and break down from there

    [33]https://github.com/w3c/string-search

      [33] https://github.com/w3c/string-search

    jck: "don't charge naively ahead"

    david: a rider on that is to say "before you try anything, try
    normalizing"

    jck: agree

    addison: wouldn't apply a K because it damages too much

    david: should say bahave "as if" NFC
    ... use as-if to avoid requiring the actual normalization

    addison: case fold still a thing
    ... written things like this
    ... fold wide/narrow? fold kana?
    ... "opened a nest of snakes"

    bert: found in an editor that suggests options, really annoying
    ... what does the author mean by this, are these specific
    options?
    ... up to browser to be smart about it

    addison: spec could allow implementations to compete on this

    richard: sounds really useful but opened a nest of snakes

    david: take into account user's locale

    addison: or page language content

    richard: and give examples
    ... will draft comment and submit it

    [34]https://github.com/w3c/string-search

      [34] https://github.com/w3c/string-search

    [35]https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/159

      [35] https://github.com/w3c/i18n-activity/issues/159

    richard: they say no modifiers but examples are all uppercase
    letters

    (discussion of various things such as numbers on some
    keyboards, some syllabaries, etc.)

    richard: so what does "modifier" mean?

    andrew: technically includes shift

    jck: needs to be very clear what they are talking about

    andrew: defined as single unicode code point
    ... but keyboards aren't limited that way

    addison: didn't we have this issue?

    richard: yes, steve raised this before

    steve: can't remember which spec, but yes
    ... have to look

    richard: chaals involved in discuss?

    okay to send

    richard: owl-time all need to be closed?

    addison: will look at and close

    richard: will issue a new list for next week

AOB?

    <r12a> ACTION: Richard to shorten the list of pending/closed
    items and reissue for next telecon discussion [recorded in
    [36]http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html#action02]

      [36] http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html#action02

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-651 - Shorten the list of
    pending/closed items and reissue for next telecon discussion
    [on Richard Ishida - due 2017-09-14].

Summary of Action Items

    [NEW] ACTION: addison: write to remote playback and indicate
    that we are satisfied and our review is in fact complete
    [recorded in
    [37]http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html#action01]
    [NEW] ACTION: Richard to shorten the list of pending/closed
    items and reissue for next telecon discussion [recorded in
    [38]http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html#action02]

      [37] http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html#action01
      [38] http://www.w3.org/2017/09/07-i18n-minutes.html#action02

Summary of Resolutions

    [End of minutes]
Received on Friday, 8 September 2017 14:44:56 UTC

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