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RE: W3C XForms vs Alternative XML UI Language Formats

From: Mark Birbeck <mark.birbeck@x-port.net>
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 21:48:17 +0100
To: "'Gerald Bauer'" <luxorxul@yahoo.ca>
Cc: <tvraman@almaden.ibm.com>, <www-forms@w3.org>
Message-ID: <001a01c42bcf$cdd799a0$0a01a8c0@W100>


You are spot on that XForms has within it an "XML UI language". As it
happens, it's one of the only languages in your list that can truly claim
that; most of the others are "XML GUI languages" or "XML widget languages"
since they deal in the main with presentation to the user in a way that is
strongly bound to desktops in a windowing environment.

But just to clarify, Raman's point about XForms being "an architecture" was
to emphasise that XForms' real power comes from its model - what sometimes
gets called 'the engine'. Specifying GUI (or widget) languages is not
exactly difficult, but defining a 'spreadsheet'-style calculation engine,
that fires events to the front-end and maintains CSS state, allows for XML
data manipulation such as submission and validation, and all without
scripting - now that's a "user interface language".

Best regards,


PS Keep up the excellent work - the "XUL Challenge" is a great initiative
(and I'm quite enjoying it!).

Mark Birbeck
x-port.net Ltd.

Download our XForms processor from

> -----Original Message-----
> From: www-forms-request@w3.org 
> [mailto:www-forms-request@w3.org] On Behalf Of Gerald Bauer
> Sent: 26 April 2004 17:53
> To: www-forms@w3.org
> Cc: tvraman@almaden.ibm.com
> Subject: Re: W3C XForms vs Alternative XML UI Language Formats
> Hello,
> > It should be made clear that XForms is *not* a XML
> > UI language
>   Well, XForms is clearly a XML UI language.
>   1) XForms is XML.
>   2) XForms includes tags for widgets (e.g. <trigger>, 
> <textarea>, <range> etc.)
> > -- XForms is about an XML Forms architecture that
> > uses an XML
> > model that can be bound to multiple UI languages
> > --- including XHTML. 
>   I understand that W3C XForms needs a hosting
> language and is not a standalone markup language.
>   Please, note that you can also bind alternative XML
> UI languages to different toolkits (e.g. Swing,
> Eclipse, Windows Forms, etc.) or even other markup
> languages (e.g. SVG, XHTML, etc.). 
> > In fact the real XUL challenge
> > for Mozilla/xul fans to bind an XUL UI to an XForms
> > model.
>   Just to clarify the XUL challenge is about XML UI
> languages (including XForms) not about Mozilla XUL. I
> use XML UI language like XML schema language as a
> generic term e.g. there are many more XML schema
> languages than W3C's XML schema language. The same
> goes for XML UI languages. Mozilla's XML UI language
> (XUL) is just one of many XML UI languages.
>   - Gerald
> -------------------
> Gerald Bauer
> Open XUL Alliance - A Rich Internet For Everyone | 
> http://xul.sourceforge.net  
> XUL News Wire | http://news.gmane.org/gmane.comp.lang.xul.announce
> ______________________________________________________________
> ________ 
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Received on Monday, 26 April 2004 16:49:40 UTC

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