W3C home > Mailing lists > Public > www-forms@w3.org > August 2002

RE: XForms Usefulness

From: Justin MacCarthy <macarthy@iol.ie>
Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2002 10:44:10 +0100
To: <www-forms@w3.org>
Cc: <xforms@yahoogroups.com>
Message-ID: <OFEGLPGPCHPACFLJPAILCEHGEBAA.macarthy@iol.ie>
Just to add to this Mozilla has slatted XFORM support in version 1.2 As for
IE, one thing that always has annoyed me is the complete lack of a roadmap
for future enhancements.And of course IE on the Mac is another issue. Of
course it would perfectly possible to create axtiveX/Applet/flash that can
render the Xform in the client.


Justin
  -----
   Original Message-----
  From: www-forms-request@w3.org [mailto:www-forms-request@w3.org]On Behalf
Of AndrewWatt2001@aol.com
  Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 9:29 AM
  To: bob@objfac.com; www-forms@w3.org
  Cc: xforms@yahoogroups.com
  Subject: Re: XForms Usefulness


  In a message dated 23/08/2002 08:49:18 GMT Daylight Time, bob@objfac.com
writes:



    Recently, someone on this list asked another why they would want to use
XSLT
    to translate xforms to xhtml.


  Since it was I who asked the question I guess I get to put in my 0.02. :)

  I found the question astonishing (how else


    could you use xforms?) but have just gotten around to commenting.


  I am sure that other list members will chime in but it is already possible
to use XForms (although possibly not the August 2002 WD yet) using, for
example, the X-Smiles browser - see http://www.x-smiles.org for further
information.

  You will find information on other XForms implementations which are in
development at http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Forms/#implementations



    It seems obvious that xforms is not very useful (and won't be) until it
is
    supported by the major browsers - the place where real users fill out
forms.


  This is pretty much a circular argument. If a spec isn't finished then the
"major" browsers likely won't implement it ... at that precise point in
time. Why would they? ... Think back. For example Microsoft got its fingers
burned by implementing a WD "XSL" which was then overtaken by XSLT. In
MSXML3 Microsoft began the process of phasing out  Microsoft XSL by allowing
their flavour to be run side by side with real XSTL. In MSXML4, as I
understand it, only real XSLT is supported.



    I haven't seen any obvious participation on this list by major browser
    suppliers. Makes me wonder if xforms will be the next xlink.


  I would be very surprised if they aren't lurking quietly on list. :) I
wouldn't necessarily expect them to show their hands publicly until they
want to make a version/product announcement.

  The number of implementations already existing for XForms puts it ahead of
XLink's implementation status by some margin, although XForms is (obviously)
not yet a full W3C Recommendation.

  Secondly, I think you also need to consider the possible use of XForms in
non-Web-browser situations. XForms implementations could be applied
appropriately in Intranet (does anyone still use that word?) situations
where data is stored in XML.  Data entry in XForms could be very useful. The
network across which data is passed need not be the global one.

  XForms are intended for use not only on desktop browsers. I am not sure if
the 3GPP is planning to support/require XForms but they have already
indicated support for SVG Tiny, for example, so XForms support *may* be in
the pipeline. Anyone know?



    (Sorry to be negative, but serious question.)

    Bob


  I am responding to your question as if it is a serious question.

  I think there are dimensions to this which your question maybe didn't
consider.

  Regards

  Andrew Watt
Received on Friday, 23 August 2002 05:43:34 GMT

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