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RE: label for, aria-label and aria-labelledby

From: Schnabel, Stefan <stefan.schnabel@sap.com>
Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 11:06:47 +0200
Message-ID: <E34714E1E6587741AD32C8E445B6F4AB01829A73@dewdfe1o.wdf.sap.corp>
To: "Alexander Surkov" <surkov.alexander@gmail.com>
Cc: <wai-xtech@w3.org>
Alex,

many thanks for your quick answer. I also posted this in 'wai-xtech-request@w3.org' (see extract below).

Well I give you 2 use cases:

1) Suppose we like to add hidden extra information to the INPUT, say an "special explanation" attribute and we want it spoken on input focus

- we don't want to use title attribute (should be reserved for other things not of interest now)
- we don't want to instantiate an extra hidden element that can be referenced by labelledby /describedby (performance reasons, don't ignore this, this one is IMPORTANT for SAP)

For me, a good + simple solution would be

<label for="Text1">Name:</label>
<input type="text" id="Text1" aria-label="special explanation" title="XYZ" />

Currently, the LABEL text will be ignored by such a combination.

2) Suppose you WANT to use labelledby in context of 1) for some reasons not of interest now

<span id="d1">Name:</span>
<input type="text" id="Text8" aria-labelledby="d1" aria-label="special explanation" title="XYZ" />

Currently, the span text will be also ignored by such a combination.

- Stefan


------------
http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-implementation/#mapping_special

3.6.1. Name and Description

It would be great if the following could be answered by some group member to SAP:

I've observed that if you declare aria-labelledby = "(idreference)" and aria-label = "xyz" at the same time for an INPUT type=text element in FF3.5 aria-label always "wins". 

There may be situations where you may need both of them. In these cases I would expect concatenation
in the AccessibleName in MSAA like "idreferencetext xyz"

Is such a feature planned e.g. for FF 3.6?

Also, is the situation clear when using old <LABEL for=".."> together with aria-labelledby = "(idreference)".
Ideally, there should be also concatenation here in my opinion (I think 3.6.1. Name and Description 1.E maps here). Currently in FF3.5 this is not working. If you want the LABEL text also included you have also to add the label id to the aria-labelledby idref list.

I know that UIAutomation may resolve these issues but please be aware of backward compliance regarding MSAA support.

This also includes full IE8 support for mapping of all aria-labelledby and aria-describedby use cases!




-----Original Message-----
From: Alexander Surkov [mailto:surkov.alexander@gmail.com] 
Sent: Montag, 29. Juni 2009 10:44
To: Schnabel, Stefan
Cc: wai-xtech@w3.org
Subject: Re: label for, aria-label and aria-labelledby

Hi, Stefan. As far as I know there is no any plans to concatenate
names in Firefox. At least until ARIA name calculation algorithm
(http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-implementation/#mapping_special_te)
won't require this explicitly. As well aria-labelledby wins on <label
for="">. Why do you prefer concatenation? One possible disadvantage I
can see is performance issue.

Alex.


On Mon, Jun 29, 2009 at 4:30 PM, Schnabel,
Stefan<stefan.schnabel@sap.com> wrote:
> I've observed that if you declare aria-labelledby = "(idreference)" and aria-label = "xyz" at the same time for an input element in FF3.5 aria-label always "wins".
>
> There may be situations where you may need both of them. In these cases I would expect concatenation
> in the AccessibleName in MSAA like "idreferencetext xyz"
>
> Is such a feature planned for FF 3.6?
>
> Also, is the situation clear when using old <LABEL for=".."> together with aria-labelledby = "(idreference)".
> Ideally, there should be also concatenation here in my opinion.
>
> Best Regards
> Stefan
>
> Dr. Stefan Schnabel
> Accessibility Expert
> SAP User Experience - Accessibility
>
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Received on Monday, 29 June 2009 09:07:33 GMT

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