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minutes: UAWG telecon 9 august 2012

From: Jim Allan <jimallan@tsbvi.edu>
Date: Thu, 9 Aug 2012 13:54:58 -0500
Message-ID: <CA+=z1W=b_4E2VYZi9LhnBSmdCTTRVoCVK_9BtmM13HV3WaRASQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: WAI-ua <w3c-wai-ua@w3.org>
from: http://www.w3.org/2012/08/09-ua-minutes.html

User Agent Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
09 Aug 2012

See also: IRC log http://www.w3.org/2012/08/09-ua-irc
Attendees

Present
    [Microsoft], Greg_Lowney, Jim_Allan, Kim_Patch, Jan, sharper, Kelly
Regrets
    jeanne
Chair
    kellyFord, JimAllan
Scribe
    jallan

Contents

    Topics
        stylesheet definition
        1.9.2 remove example 4 related to Amaya. Development work has
stopped on Amaya. Jim thinks example not useful.
        whats left to do
        action 733 def of shortcut
    Summary of Action Items

<trackbot> Date: 09 August 2012

to http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012AprJun/0123.html)

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012AprJun/0083.html Action-729

Latest editor's draft -

http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2012/ED-IMPLEMENTING-UAAG20-20120802/

action jeanne to remove Action-505 from 2.11.3, remove Action-518 from
2.11.2, remove Action-699 and 644 from

<trackbot> Created ACTION-751 - Remove Action-505 from 2.11.3, remove
Action-518 from 2.11.2, remove Action-699 and 644 from [on Jeanne F
Spellman - due 2012-08-16].

<Jan> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012AprJun/0083.html
stylesheet definition

action-729

<scribe> scribe: jallan

<Jan> Style Sheet: A mechanism for communicating *style property*
settings for web content, in which the style property settings are
separable from other content resources. This separation is what allows
author style sheets to be toggled and user style sheets defined to
apply to more than one resource. Style sheet *web content
technologies* include Cascading Style Sheets (CSS) and Extensible...

<Jan> ...Stylesheet Language (XSL).

<Jan> *User Style Sheet: Where the user specifies which style sheet(s)
to use, resulting in *user styles*.

<Jan> *Author Style Sheet: Where the author specifies which style
sheet(s) to use, resulting in *author styles*.

<Jan> 1.7.1 Support User Style Sheets: If the user agent supports
*author style sheets*, then *user style sheets* are also supported.
(Level A)

<Jan> 1.7.2 Scope of User Style Sheets: If *user style sheets* are
supported, the user can specify that they are applied to any of the
following: (Level A)

<Jan> (a) the current page, and

<Jan> (b) all pages on specified web sites, and

<Jan> (c) all pages.

<Jan> 1.7.3 Author Style Sheet Toggle: The user can turn off any
*author style sheet* for both of the following: (Level A)

<Jan> (a) the current page; and

<Jan> (b) all pages that reference the style sheet.

<Jan> 1.7.4 Save Author Style Sheets: The user can save *author style
sheets* to modify them for use as *user style sheets*. (Level AA)

<Jan> Style Properties:

<Jan> Properties whose values determine the presentation (e.g., font,
color, size, location, padding, volume, synthesized speech prosody) of
content elements as they are rendered (e.g. onscreen, via loudspeaker,
via braille display) by user agents. Style properties can have several
origins:

<Jan> *user agent default styles*: The default style property values
applied in the absence of any author or user styles. Some *web content
technologies* specify a default rendering; others do not.

<Jan> *author styles*: Style property values that are set by the
author as part of the content (e.g., in-line styles, author style
sheets).

<Jan> *user styles*: Style property values that are set by the user of
a user agent (e.g., via user agent interface settings, user style
sheets).

gl: def of stylesheet looks ok

<Greg> Style Sheet: A mechanism for communicating *style property*
settings for web content, in which the style property settings are
separable from other content resources. This separation is what allows
author style sheets to be toggled or substituted, and user style
sheets defined to apply to more than one resource. Style sheet *web
content technologies* include Cascading Style Sheets (CSS) and...

<Greg> ...Extensible Stylesheet Language (XSL).

gl: wants user and author styleheet defs to be complete sentences

<Greg> *Author Style Sheet: Style sheets specified by the user,
resulting in *author styles*.

<Greg> *User Style Sheet: Style sheets specified by the user,
resulting in *user styles*.

<Greg> *Author Style Sheet: Style sheets specified by the author,
resulting in *author styles*.

<Jan> Style Sheet: A mechanism for communicating *style property*
settings for web content, in which the style property settings are
separable from other content resources. This separation is what allows
author style sheets to be toggled or substituted, and user style
sheets defined to apply to more than one resource. Style sheet *web
content technologies* include Cascading Style Sheets (CSS) and...

<Jan> ...Extensible Stylesheet Language (XSL).

<Jan> *User Style Sheet: Style sheets specified by the user, resulting
in *user styles*.

<Jan> *Author Style Sheet: Style sheets specified by the author,
resulting in *author styles*.

<Greg> (Either complete sentences or noun phrases.)

resolution: definition of stylesheet, User style sheet, and author
style sheet to be added to glossary as written by Jan above

Style Properties:

Properties whose values determine the presentation (e.g., font, color,
size, location, padding, volume, synthesized speech prosody) of
content elements as they are rendered (e.g. onscreen, via loudspeaker,
via braille display) by user agents. Style properties can have several
origins:

*user agent default styles*: The default style property values applied
in the absence of any author or user styles. Some *web content
technologies* specify a default rendering; others do not.

*author styles*: Style property values that are set by the author as
part of the content (e.g., in-line styles, author style sheets).

*user styles*: Style property values that are set by the user of a
user agent (e.g., via user agent interface settings, user style
sheets).

<Jan> *user styles*: Style property values that are set by the user
(e.g., via user agent interface settings, user style sheets).

Style Properties:

Properties whose values determine the presentation (e.g., font, color,
size, location, padding, volume, synthesized speech prosody) of
content elements as they are rendered (e.g. onscreen, via loudspeaker,
via braille display) by user agents. Style properties can have several
origins:

*user agent default styles*: The default style property values applied
in the absence of any author or user styles. Some *web content
technologies* specify a default rendering; others do not.

*author styles*: Style property values that are set by the author as
part of the content (e.g., in-line styles, author style sheets).

*user styles*: Style property values that are set by the user (e.g.,
via user agent interface settings, user style sheets).

resolution: jeanne will add the definition of Style Properties to the
glossary (by Jallan above)

discussion of versions of 1.7 in the document.

gl: concern that 1.7.2, 3, 4 require author and user style sheets,
regardless of status of 1.7.1

<Jan> http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2012/ED-UAAG20-20120802/#gl-style-sheets-config

<KimPatch> www.w3.org/TR/IMPLEMENTING-UAAG20/

<kford> Group continues to look at document versions.

<kford> \kford: Let's just update the text to what we want it to say
now and give Jeanne an action to update.

<Jan> 1.7.2 Apply User Stylesheets: If *user style sheets* are
supported, then the user can enable or disable user stylesheets for:
(Level A)

<Jan> (a) all pages on specified web sites, or

<Jan> (b) all pages.

<kford> ACTION: JS Update 1.7.2 with the current text from JAN for
1.7.2 [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/08/09-ua-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-752 - Update 1.7.2 with the current text
from JAN for 1.7.2 [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2012-08-16].

<Jan> JR: Jeanne...for action 752 see the text immediately above

1.7.3 Author Style Sheets: If *author style sheets* are supported,
then the user can disable the use of author stylesheets on the current
page. (Level A)

<Greg> I updated the action 752 to read "Update 1.7.2 and 1.7.3 with
the current text from JAN for 1.7.2" and added the text of both.

<Greg> We decided that we don't need to add an If clause at the
beginning of 1.7.4 because if the UA does not support style sheets
there will be no referenced style sheets to save.

<kford> zaki8m, agenda?
1.9.2 remove example 4 related to Amaya. Development work has stopped
on Amaya. Jim thinks example not useful.

<Greg> I note that the latest version of Amaya is from January, which
is not that long ago.

gl: is there another browser with an outline view
whats left to do

resolution: leave amaya example in 1.9.2

Action-733 definition of shortcut (kim)

Action-500, 545, issue 87 Structural navigation

ACTION-720: Ensure disabling images gets in 2.11 (Provide control of
content that may reduce accessibility) (done?)

<trackbot> ACTION-720 Ensure disabling images gets in 2.11 (Provide
control of content that may reduce accessibility) notes added

ACTION-743: Look at cleaning up glossary terms "serial access,
sequential navigation" and linear navigation commands

<trackbot> ACTION-743 Look at cleaning up glossary terms "serial
access, sequential navigation" and linear navigation commands notes
added

<kford> Talking about shortcut

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2012AprJun/0080.html
action 733 def of shortcut

<KimPatch> shortcut

<KimPatch> A command thatís tied to a particular UI control or
application function, allowing the user to navigate to or activate the
control or function without traversing any intervening controls. A
shortcut is modality independent, meaning it is accessible by any
input method (e.g. keyboard, mouse, speech, touch or gesture). Also
see Modality Independence Principle.

<KimPatch> Proposed editing changes for keyboard command to better fit
with Shortcut definition

<KimPatch> keyboard command (keyboard binding, keyboard shortcut or
accelerator keys)

<KimPatch> A key or set of keys that are tied to a particular UI
control or application function, allowing the user to navigate to or
activate the control or function without traversing any intervening
controls (e.g. "ctrl"+"S" to save a document). It is sometimes useful
to distinguish keyboard commands that are associated with controls
that are rendered in the current context (e.g. "alt"+"D" to move...

<KimPatch> ...focus to the address bar) from those that may be able to
activate program functionality that is not associated with any
currently rendered controls (e.g. "F1" to open the Help system).
Keyboard commands help users accelerate their selections. Also see
Shortcut.

gl: 2nd sentence is confusing.

command=open file, shortcut would be control+o, or a speech shortcut
or a gesture

jr: are you saying if you have a shortcut that it must be modality independent

kp: right

discussion of modality independence

kp: I was tasked to do this definition in terms of modality independence.

jr: need a solid definition of shortcut that include MI

<Greg> SC that use the term "shortcut" include:

<Greg> 1.8.12 Webpage bookmarks [was 1.8.m]: The user can mark items
in a webpage, then navigate back to marked items using shortcuts. The
user can specify whether a navigation mark disappears after a session
or is persistent across sessions. (Level AA?)

<Greg> 2.3.4 Present Direct Commands in User Interface (former 2.1.7):
The user can have any direct commands (e.g. keyboard shortcuts) in the
user agent user interface be presented with their associated user
interface controls (e.g. "Ctrl+S" displayed on the "Save" menu item
and toolbar button). (Level AA)

<Greg> Oops, 2.3.4 is specifically keyboard shortcuts.

<Greg> So 1.8.12 is the only SC that uses "shortcut" rather than
"keyboard shortcut".

<Greg> (It's also used in IER.)

gl: there are lots of 'shortcut' in IERs

kp: suggests reviewing document for proper use of shortcut and
keyboard shortcuts

<Greg> The earlier discussion was about whether the second sentence of
Kim's proposed definition of shortcut adds a requirement that all
shortcuts to be modality independent, or merely suggests they be so,
or acknowledges that they can be.

<KimPatch> ACTION: Kim to go through document looking at instances of
keyboard shortcut to make sure they are properly "keyboard shortcut",
not "shortcut" (see shortcut definition) [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/08/09-ua-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-753 - Go through document looking at
instances of keyboard shortcut to make sure they are properly
"keyboard shortcut", not "shortcut" (see shortcut definition) [on
Kimberly Patch - due 2012-08-16].

gl: will we then revisit the definition.
... in html5 there is notion of 'command' - you can have a shortcut,
or button or voice command to activate.

kp: we are using the word shortcut to mean MI command.

gl: so in 1.8.12 the user can use button, or keyboard command.

<Greg> So it comes down to, should 1.8.12 in conjunction with the
definition require the user be able to use both keyboard commands and
toolbar buttons for navigation?

kp: the method of activation be modality independent (MI), the UA
needs to ensure that the control is accessible regardless of modality
... you could use scroll bars, as long as speech user or keyboard user
can use it.

keyboard command (keyboard binding, keyboard shortcut or accelerator keys)

A key or set of keys that are tied to a particular UI control or
application function, allowing the user to navigate to or activate the
control or function without traversing any intervening controls (e.g.
"ctrl"+"S" to save a document). It is sometimes useful to distinguish
keyboard commands that are associated with controls that are rendered
in the current context (e.g. "alt"+"D" to move...

scribe: focus to the address bar) from those that may be able to
activate program functionality that is not associated with any
currently rendered controls (e.g. "F1" to open the Help system).
Keyboard commands help users accelerate their selections. Also see
Shortcut.

<KimPatch> ORIGINAL

<KimPatch> keyboard command (keyboard binding,keyboard shortcuts or
accelerator keys)

<KimPatch> Commands tied to particular UI controls or application
functions, allowing the user to navigate-to or activate them without
traversing any intervening controls (e.g. "ctrl"+"S" to save a
document). It is sometimes useful to distinguish keyboard commands
that are associated with controls that are rendered in the current
context (e.g. "alt"+"D" to move focus to the address bar) from those
that...

<KimPatch> ...may be able to activate program functionality that is
not associated with any currently rendered controls (e.g. "F1" to open
the Help system). Keyboard commands help users accelerate their
selections.

kim modified so shortcut and keyboard command better align

<Greg> Could add "This could be used with physical keyboard or
keyboard emulator (e.g. on-screen keyboard or speech recognition)."

gl: suggests adding a statement in keyboard command to cover shortcuts
so the user doesn't have to parse 3 definitions

<KimPatch> keyboard command (keyboard binding, keyboard shortcut or
accelerator keys)

<KimPatch> A key or set of keys that are tied to a particular UI
control or application function, allowing the user to navigate to or
activate the control or function without traversing any intervening
controls (e.g. "ctrl"+"S" to save a document). It is sometimes useful
to distinguish keyboard commands that are associated with controls
that are rendered in the current context (e.g. "alt"+"D" to move...

<KimPatch> ...focus to the address bar) from those that may be able to
activate program functionality that is not associated with any
currently rendered controls (e.g. "F1" to open the Help system).
Keyboard commands help users accelerate their selections. This could
be used with physical keyboard or keyboard emulator (e.g. on-screen
keyboard or speech recognition). Also see Shortcut.

<Greg> I'd put the new sentence before the one about help users
accelerate their selection...

<Greg> and also change that sentence to avoid using the term selection
which has a very narrow, technical meaning separate from activation
and focus navigation.

<KimPatch> keyboard command (keyboard binding, keyboard shortcut or
accelerator keys)

<KimPatch> A key or set of keys that are tied to a particular UI
control or application function, allowing the user to navigate to or
activate the control or function without traversing any intervening
controls (e.g. "ctrl"+"S" to save a document). It is sometimes useful
to distinguish keyboard commands that are associated with controls
that are rendered in the current context (e.g. "alt"+"D" to move...

<KimPatch> ...focus to the address bar) from those that may be able to
activate program functionality that is not associated with any
currently rendered controls (e.g. "F1" to open the Help system).
Keyboard commands can be triggered using a physical keyboard or
keyboard emulator (e.g. on-screen keyboard or speech recognition).
Also see Shortcut.

<Greg> "Keyboard command can be triggered using a physical keyboard or
keyboard emulator (e.g. on-screen keyboard or speech recognition)."

resolution: jeanne to add the keyboard command definition from kimpatch above

<Greg> Elsewhere we don't put Ctrl in quotation marks.

<Greg> There are two places where "Ctrl" is in quotes, and three or so without.

<scribe> ACTION: jeanne to add "keyboard command (keyboard binding,
keyboard shortcut or accelerator keys) [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/08/09-ua-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-754 - Add "keyboard command (keyboard
binding, keyboard shortcut or accelerator keys) [on Jeanne F Spellman
- due 2012-08-16].

A key or set of keys that are tied to a particular UI control or
application function, allowing the user to navigate to or activate the
control or function without traversing any intervening controls (e.g.
CTRL+"S" to save a document). It is sometimes useful to distinguish
keyboard commands that are associated with controls that are rendered
in the current context (e.g. ALT+"D" to move...

scribe: focus to the address bar) from those that may be able to
activate program functionality that is not associated with any
currently rendered controls (e.g. "F1" to open the Help system).
Keyboard commands can be triggered using a physical keyboard or
keyboard emulator (e.g. on-screen keyboard or speech recognition).
Also see Shortcut." to glossary
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: jeanne to add "keyboard command (keyboard binding,
keyboard shortcut or accelerator keys) [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/08/09-ua-minutes.html#action03]
[NEW] ACTION: JS Update 1.7.2 with the current text from JAN for 1.7.2
[recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/08/09-ua-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: Kim to go through document looking at instances of
keyboard shortcut to make sure they are properly "keyboard shortcut",
not "shortcut" (see shortcut definition) [recorded in
http://www.w3.org/2012/08/09-ua-minutes.html#action02]

[End of minutes]

-- 
Jim Allan, Accessibility Coordinator & Webmaster
Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired
1100 W. 45th St., Austin, Texas 78756
voice 512.206.9315    fax: 512.206.9264  http://www.tsbvi.edu/
"We shape our tools and thereafter our tools shape us." McLuhan, 1964
Received on Thursday, 9 August 2012 18:55:24 GMT

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