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Minutes - UAWG 23 July 2009

From: Jim Allan <jimallan@tsbvi.edu>
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2009 13:34:15 -0500
To: "'UAWG list'" <w3c-wai-ua@w3.org>
Message-ID: <002001ca0bc4$2eab6340$8c0229c0$@edu>
http://www.w3.org/2009/07/23-ua-minutes.html 

User Agent Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference
23 Jul 2009

See also: IRC log (http://www.w3.org/2009/07/23-ua-irc) 
Attendees

Present
    Kelly, Henny, Jeanne, Kim, Jan, Mark, Greg, Jim, Simon
Regrets
Chair
    Jim_Allan
Scribe
    AllanJ

Contents

    * Topics
         1. Logistics (Regrets, agenda requests, comments)?
         2. 23 Jul Survey - http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090722/
         3. Proposal 4.x Rationale
         4. Face to face possible meeting dates
         5. F2F
         6. Discussion of other work beyond just guideline document UAAG needs to complete
         7. other UAWG documents
         8. Open issues and actions
         9. review action items
        10. editor�s draft status - http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2009/ED-UAAG20-20090625/
        11. HTML 5 and UAAG
        12. HTML 5
    * Summary of Action Items

 

 

<trackbot> Date: 23 July 2009

<scribe> scribe: AllanJ
Logistics (Regrets, agenda requests, comments)?
23 Jul Survey - http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090722/

http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090722/results

KF: UAs could improve in direct selection (numbering etc.) and performing actions
... begin reviewing survey

GL: interesting...navigation but also visual indication.
Proposal 4.x Rationale

http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090722/results#xq5

GL: navigation items could be integrated with keyboard access success criteria
... assign keyboard shortcuts by type

<Greg> Overarching comment is to fold these into existing SC about about "direct keyboard commands" for enabled elements; this is adding the option to have the UA add them for all enabled elements that don't have them.

<Greg> Then, the option to have those direct keyboard commands displayed visually is already covered by 4.1.5.

<Greg> Although we could add the recommendations that the use be able to show/hide those shortcuts by category or type, and to adjust their visual display (although that is really one example of a more general problem of letting the user customize the display of all sorts of information.

KF: Mark move to 4.7
... not necessarily about shortcut keys

<scribe> ...new - identify actionable elements

<Greg> I said I think it's more appropriate for 4.1 because 4.7 is about structured navigation, and this proposal isn't structural because it treats elements identically regardless of where they are in the heirarchy.

KP: instead of 'tabbing' through hundreds of links. need more efficient way to navigate
... different than a shortcut. A different layer.
... need a scheme, not random shortcuts.

GL: lots equate direct navigation with 'accesskey', direct navigation should be more general.

KP: How would you change this?

<Greg> My suggestion is summarized: I still lean towards replacing this proposed section with the recommendation that the UA provide an option to assign direct keyboard commands to all enabled elements that lack them. The display of those direct keyboard command would already be covered by 4.1.5 (Discovery of Keyboard Commands).

http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/36791/20090722/results#xq2

GL: specific example of firefox plugin to number links

KF: not sure if 4.1 or 4.7 provides functionality that KP proposes
... 4.7 should be about new navigation concepts and direct selection of elements

KP: makes sense. it is an extension of direct navigation

KF: where we put it is only part. need to review proposals.

JR: 4.1 is about full keyboard access.
... 4.15 discovery of keyboard commands.
... main point of KP proposal is author has not provide direct access
... UA imposes needed access for efficiency

KF: need direct selection

<Greg> Show/hide direct keyboard commands are equivalent to show/hide alt text, etc.

KP: user needs ability change show/hide link number indicators

GL: similar to show/hide alternative content. could we have something general that covers both
... and/or visual indicator of what is a link

KP: should be more global not a per instance
... UA puts numbers by links, but overwrite contents, some users may need bigger number or high contrast or translucent

<Greg> How about something like "the user should be able to easily toggle options that change the rendering of the page."

KP: and be able to quickly turn them on/off

JR: configurability must be there. perhaps in techniques say how to configure

KF: dynamic updating?

<Greg> Ability to halt updating of display of those links, is that the same as stopping update of the page altogether?

KP: dynamic updating of content poses problems. should be a way to stop or change timing.

KF: don't hear disagreement on needs for these functions
... level of detail on some of these is too specific (configurability)
... configurability should be clear across all features
... process...other items...continue to hash this, or take a second path.

KP: where should these go. arguments are good for 4.1 or 4.7
... I need to know what is already covered. and what should be move to techniques

<Greg> Suggest a new SC equivalent "the user should be able to easily toggle options that change the layout of the page."

GL: toggle link numbers, alt text, etc.
... hopefully would cover KP suggestions

KP: where does that go?

GL: don't know. first see if approach is right, then put it somewhere
... is same thing true for updating page items 4.x.5

<Greg> I'd recommend the same approach to Kim's proposed 4.x.5, something about generally toggling the updating of the page.

KF: Perhaps Guideline 3 Perceivable. could we have GL item here

KP: works for me

GL: expand 3.1 beyond 'alt'

KF: not expand 3.1. the content in 4.x.5 is not author content, it is UA content.
... conceptually they are different and should be separated
... MH is correct. This is a new concept. 4.1.7 is a good new home.

JR: GL point of easy toggling is good. UA provide keyboard commands for all actvie elements not just author supplied keybinding.

<Zakim> Jan, you wanted to say "a requirement for UAs to provide keyboard commands for all active elements even when no ceyboard command provided by author"

<scribe> ...new concept. UA should provide enhancements to the interface

MH: good. UA providing additional functionality.

KF: Proposal - MH and KP find way to integrate to 4.7, and GL create a guideline in GL3 for toggling display of enhanced functionality
... Henny could you work with MH & KP efforts.

<scribe> ACTION: KP to incorporate KP proposal for navigation in the UA (includes MH and HS) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/23-ua-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-210 - Incorporate KP proposal for navigation in the UA (includes MH and HS) [on Kimberly Patch - due 2009-07-30].

<scribe> ACTION: GL to write generic criteria for configurability of UI and content UI controls (turn on/off, visual presentation, etc) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/23-ua-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-211 - Write generic criteria for configurability of UI and content UI controls (turn on/off, visual presentation, etc) [on Greg Lowney - due 2009-07-30].
Face to face possible meeting dates
F2F

KF: discusses times
... various problems with timings and budgets

SH: teaching week of Nov 2, travel too tight other times.

KF: Boston option.

KP: +1

MH: +1

GL: lots of other travel already - perhaps

JS: need a sponsor.

KF: working on that. MIT host?
... Tentatively schedule F2F Nov 9-13 in Boston

<Jan> JR: I can make it that week - likely by phone
Discussion of other work beyond just guideline document UAAG needs to complete
other UAWG documents

KF: need techniques document

JR: ATAG incorporating 'understanding' into techniques

<KFord> http://www.w3.org/TR/cuap

<KFord> This was the doc from Jeanne.

JS: covered HTTP and UA errors, presented as an idea for format/structure

GL: follow WCAG and ATAG examples.

ALL: discuss

JR: shares ATAG experience. using 'intent' - why a guideline is there who it should help, etc.

KF: want to get a roadmap to develop necessary documents.

JS: what we are required to do is based on UAWG charter

<jeanne> http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2008/draft_uawg_charter_20mar08.html

JS: guidelines and techniques

zakim: open item 6
Open issues and actions
review action items

KF: all update your action items, make a new date or say not going to happen. for not happening email KF so we can create an issue so we don't loose items

SH: did we ever review SH issues?

KF: issues vs actions. talk about issues next week.
... need to trim actions. issues are new potential work.
editor�s draft status - http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/2009/ED-UAAG20-20090625/

JS: new working draft published!!

<jeanne> http://www.w3.org/TR/2009/WD-UAAG20-20090723/
HTML 5 and UAAG
HTML 5

KF: how to pay more attention.
... canvas element and how to make accessible

<Henny> HTML5 and canvas accessibility from Steve Faulkner http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/?p=362

KF: all please read peruse HTML 5

http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/

editors draft: http://dev.w3.org/html5/spec/Overview.html

GL: is there a list of all the guidelines that impact accessibility.

JS: PFWG covers this.

KF: PF would like UAWG to track work that impacts accessibility of UAs

<Greg> (Rather than guidelines per se, I was asking about a list of current projects affecting Web accessibility.)

<jeanne> In answer to Greg's question: Here is the Protocols and Formats working group list. http://www.w3.org/TR/#WD

<scribe> ACTION: KF to develop list of UA support of web technologies and accessibility, how does other work impact UA, make UAAG more relevant to web community (includes JA and MH) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/23-ua-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-212 - Develop list of UA support of web technologies and accessibility, how does other work impact UA, make UAAG more relevant to web community (includes JA and MH) [on Kelly Ford - due 2009-07-30].

KF: should be a clearing house, link to other information on UAWG home page

<mth> ARIA Role support in UA's http://www.paciellogroup.com/blog/aria-tests/ARIA-SafariaOperaIEFF.html
Summary of Action Items
[NEW] ACTION: GL to write generic criteria for configurability of UI and content UI controls (turn on/off, visual presentation, etc) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/23-ua-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: KF to develop list of UA support of web technologies and accessibility, how does other work impact UA, make UAAG more relevant to web community (includes JA and MH) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/23-ua-minutes.html#action03]
[NEW] ACTION: KP to incorporate KP proposal for navigation in the UA (includes MH and HS) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/23-ua-minutes.html#action01]

Jim Allan, Accessibility Coordinator & Webmaster
Texas School for the Blind and Visually Impaired
1100 W. 45th St., Austin, Texas 78756
voice 512.206.9315    fax: 512.206.9264  http://www.tsbvi.edu/
"We shape our tools and thereafter our tools shape us." McLuhan, 1964
Received on Thursday, 23 July 2009 18:47:36 GMT

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